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Kiwi_Roy

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Kiwi_Roy last won the day on April 6

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About Kiwi_Roy

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    Old Phart

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  • My bikes
    72 Eldorado, 2007 Griso
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    Penitentiary New Westminster BC

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  1. Low Voltage at the gauge might make it read low but I suspect it would read erratically The pulses to the tach come from the ECU, I doubt it would be missing pulses.
  2. Yes I think 8 is low, less than 60% normal, its ok to dip down until it gets spinning but if it stays low the spark will also be weak making it extra hard to catch How about taking the same reading when you get your new battery.
  3. http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzi007/schematics/2007_Norge.gif BTW the starter (25) shown on here is nonsense. You replaced the wire between the relay/5 and the starter, that's good but only half the job. According to Carl's drawing you still have a Start relay powered through the ignition switch. This is easy to check, find the Start relay and see if the main contact 3 is alive with the key Off. Strange as it may seem the more current you can cram into the solenoid spade connector the less power (Watt seconds) it uses because it gets the job done quicker. While the solenoid is engaging the starter gear the battery has nothing else to do, it doesn't start spinning the motor until the gear is engaged. On these bikes its suggested you snip the yellow wire below the relay and splice it onto a new yellow 16 gauge run direct to the battery through a new fuse or perhaps splice it into the RH main fuse Switched Fuse B still feeds 9, 12 & 19 through the original yellow The number plate light on these bikes was trying to tell us something, I'm sure it was going dim whenever the starter was making the dreaded SI click
  4. Guys often get the transformer rule mixed up with Ohms law. If you drop the Voltage through a transformer the current goes up as the Voltage goes down, it 's really not applicable to your bike.
  5. Any battery can put out 12 Volts no load, its how much will it put out under load is the thing. You can take it and have it load tested but the starter is a pretty good indication, probably over 100 Amps Fix your meter to the battery terminals and take a reading while it's grunting to get it over the hump of compression. Which reminds me I've been meaning to check my old loop for weeks it has a Power Patrol SLA1116 of 18 AH rating, I thought it was on the way out. First off I connected my Voltmeter to the charging leads with a couple of jumper leads, it read 12.9 Volts. I lifted the plug caps off so it wouldn't start and ground away for about a minute in several second bursts it would drop down to 10.9 while cranking. I was shocked half an hour later when it was still reading 11.8 and holding 10 while cranking, occasionally compression would catch it off guard and the Volts would pull right down to 7 for a second but it would come back to 10 once it got spinning. All this time the headlight was burning. My test wasn't very scientific, I should have measured the current at least but I didn't expect it to last more than a few spins of the motor but at least I have established a point of 10 Volts while cranking and have a healthy respect for this battery. Of course you don't want the Voltage to drop much under 10 or you may not have enough for a reliable spark, this old girl doesn't mind. If I had measured the Amperage I would have seen it shoot right up while the motor was stalled and come down once the motor started to spin, motors also act as generators as they spin they generate Voltage in the opposite direction (commonly known as Back EMF (back Electro-Motive Force)) which subtracts from the forward Voltage to bring the current down.
  6. Be sure to give us a ride report, I'm sure you will be surprised what the old girl can do.
  7. Thanks for weighing in Docc, I have no experience with swapping starters. Sorry it was me that mentioned Bosch, Gatorman said D6RA2 It sounds as though Gatorman has the bikes original starter as well though, that should fit I still don't know for sure he is talking about a VII or something else, we don't have the obligatory picture, LOL So it turns out to be a VII Bassa at least that's what it says on the side cover, beautuful mile muncher, the EVs had foot boards, I prefer the pegs and love those tubeless wheels, a classic Guzzi for sure.
  8. Barely run in then, perhaps there is something different wrong. BTW I think most automotive starters rotate in the other direction, if you look at how the motor sits in relation to the engine the car approaches from the front, the Guzzi approaches from the rear so the slip clutch has to be different, if the previous owner replaced the original with an auto one, can you confirm it's never run since it was replaced? Has the bike run from a bump start? Can you confirm the fields aren't loose? Looking at the front of the crankshaft the Guzzi runs clockwise but looking from the same direction the starter rotates counter clockwise. How is the battery is installed?
  9. Your starter seems to be one Guzzi use, sorry I don't know if there is a difference but someone will Any identification of the model at all VII Sport perhaps, can you post a picture, someone may be able to tell by the Vin No but not I Can you post a picture of the bike? What mileage has it done? Feed us a bit more information and we will get you going. Where are you located, perhaps you are close to another Guzzi owner who could help. Yes Negative is ground.
  10. I really doubt the starter needed replacing after such a short life, who knows what he stuck on. An OEM starter can't cost too much. You did check the battery direction? On re-reading I see you bought a D6RA2, that looks right but I have never bought a new starter Please double check you have the right battery polarity. What is the milage on the bike? Do you mean a VII EV? Bassa or Jackal, all very similar
  11. Just to confirm the old Bosch style wound field starters always rotate the same way because both the Armature and Fields are reversed. The Valeo runs backwards because the fields are fixed and only the Armature is changed Its easy to tell the difference because the wound field type have the 4 screws for holding the pole pieces in place. BTW I have re-named the second coil inside the solenoid the "Grunt coil", it does the Grunt work and you guys might remember it better The Holding coil 10 Amps and the Grunt coil 40 Amps, don't forget LOL
  12. Gatorman, thats a bit of a weird one usually the starter doesn't spin until its engaged, the solenoid has to engage the gear before the main contacts will close. Have you had the battery out? Is the battery in backwards, a Valeo starter will turn backwards and not drive, a Bosch doesn't care, it always rotates the same way I believe the Valeo has a slip clutch that will prevent it driving on overrun or battery backwards. No, fuel injection makes no difference but the fuel injected bikes have a safety diode to protect the ECU if the battery is connected backwards
  13. I'm not sure if you have solved this yet or not. Its caused by LED blinkers that draw next to no current and an idiot light that draws as much I came across this sketch I had done for another owner The type 194 lamp reference is to my favourite LED replacement for the Spine frame and EV idiot lights. (I can't recall if I still needed the diodes) I have some pictures of that if anyone is interested, because LEDs last forever I throw away the sockets and glue lamps in place. BTW all 12 Volt LEDs have a resistor or current limiter in series, we just don't bother showing it. Headlights for instance only need about 9 Volts, the rest is gravy, it gets no brighter.
  14. As I said earlier if you touch a wire from the battery + to the spade connector that bypasses the start circuit Ignition switch and some connectors, this is how the starter should work, not thru a bunch of spaghetti wiring. You have probably seen me rant on about how the solenoid draws over 40 Amps i know of a couple of VIIs that burnt up because the main ground was connected to the bolt of the seat lock rather than a gearbox bolt. The seat lock bolt worked loose so the starter return current found its way back to the battery via the ground wire from the Voltage Regulator to battery negative. If you connect your meter from battery Negative (I mean the actual battery post not the lug) to a grounded bolt on the engine a bad main ground will show up as Voltage drop while cranking, I would expect to see less than 0.5 Volts I think Docc's 2000 may be wired with the Start Relay/30 wired direct from a fuse (not switched) Notice how the starter relay/30 terminal on this earlier bike is powered from an always live fuse 5, these early bikes never suffer Startus Interuptus but if you look down at the starter solenoid like all other Guzzi schematics its drawn wrong, one coil (the Grunt coil) is missing, the one that draws 40 Amps to pull in the solenoid. Fuse 5 can easily provide 50 Amps for a split second, the solenoid will slam the gear into mesh (in about 15 milliseconds) and the starter will spin. Now look at this one from a few years later, Luigi has completely changed the way the start relay is powered, terminal 30 is now fed from the Ignition Switch and a lot of spaghetti wires with several plug in connectors for good measure, he had another attempt at drawing the starter solenoid but again completely missed the Grunt coil. The supply to the starter relay is now seriously compromised, it will sluggishly draw the starter into mesh if it's a good day. Once engaged it will spin ok. On a bad day the Voltage drop will be too much, it won't engage and you get the dreaded click, it might also blow the 15 Amp F4 If you click on this drawing it will be easier to read. BTW, most of the modern Guzzis are compromised in the same way, works ok while everything is nice and new but as the connections start to deteriorate and the switch picks up some resistance the coil inrush current drops off until the grunt coil isn't able to do its job. MPH has made a small fortune selling kits to correct the situation. Both Veleo and Bosh starters have a Grunt Coil, I think the modern starters are a different brand but they will also. BTW, I recently purchased an 07 Griso, I made the starter solenoid operate 3 x as fast as Luigi had it just by increasing the wire size from relay to solenoid. If the factory would only draw the starter properly Startus Interrupts would soon be extinct LOL Sorry I added this just to show the Grunt Coil in the solenoid ( 0.25 Ohm)
  15. I keep looking for uses for reed switches, those of you who have an old loop may recognize this Underneath it has 3 2 Amp switches activated by tiny magnets embedded in the lever. The lamps I use are LED so they don't draw a lot of current Because I'm still using the original sealed beam headlight I added a relay in the headlight bucket to select Low or High beam. The levers are just held in place by the magnets and small bits of steel screws act as an indents. I have since replaced the wires with a small cable salvaged from a computer mouse. The levers are a little different now, I will try to remember to get a better picture.
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