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Cannot Bleed Clutch Slave


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13 minutes ago, Lucky Phil said:

There could well be a lot of air trapped at the top hose connection to the master cylinder. Unbolt the master and carefully with the cap off tilt it so the reservoir is higher than the banjo connection and jiggle the lever. By jiggle the lever I mean just that, dont attempt to actuate the lever just jiggle it in it's play region. You will see air bubbles come into the reservoir. You can also while you have it in this position tap the accessible clutch line with the handle of a screwdriver to break free any air bubbles. They will come into the reservoir once again.

Ciao

I'll definitely give that a try; key to the whole thing was disassembling the lever assembly so I could verify that the m/c piston was moving normally once I had confidence that it was working, I moved on the gravity technique mentioned above, and as you said, I tapped on the m/c and the slave as well, I think it helped but I will position the m/c as you describe and give it a go.

Now the good or bad depending, when I disassembled the clutch lever to verify the piston worked in the m/c, I lost the tiny plastic piston that contacts the clutch safety switch, I'm hoping that just means that I've bypassed the safety switch and it will start and run normally.

I had read a lot already on bypassing the clutch safety switch, I didn't realize I would do it by other methods,,lol

Tks

Kelly 

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There could well be a lot of air trapped at the top hose connection to the master cylinder. Unbolt the master and carefully with the cap off tilt it so the reservoir is higher than the banjo connectio

Hey Docc,    Tbh, when I thought I was simply bypassing the safety switch, I didn't look that hard for it the 2nd time, knowing that I needed that little bit to get the bike going, changed the urgency

A KTM trick is to zip tie the lever to bar overnight. Turn bars so reservoir is highest. It has worked for me, on my KTM anyway. Even after rebuilding  brake M/C and bleeding, it still had spongy leve

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Hmm, actually no. That interface button is used to close the switch so the starter will engage.

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52 minutes ago, docc said:

Hmm, actually no. That interface button is used to close the switch so the starter will engage.

Docc, that's not the right answer,lol.

I dropped and found that little piece once,,, I don't think the finding part is happening the second time,,lol

I'll look for that little piece again, but if I don't find it, what would be the best solution.

ie Trace the wires back to the bullet connectors on the left side of the tank, disconnect them, wire them together bypassing the clutch switch completely?

Tks

Kelly

 

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Seems it would not be difficult to fashion a little pusher from a scrap of Delrin or such. I would be concerned Nylon might swell from moisture exposure there.

I suppose lots of folks have defeated their clutch lock-out by shorting the connectors. Even with the Neutral Switch/ Neutral Relay functional, the bike could then start in gear with the sidestand up. Simple enough to keep the habit of holding the clutch for start-up.

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24 minutes ago, docc said:

Seems it would not be difficult to fashion a little pusher from a scrap of Delrin or such. I would be concerned Nylon might swell from moisture exposure there.

I suppose lots of folks have defeated their clutch lock-out by shorting the connectors. Even with the Neutral Switch/ Neutral Relay functional, the bike could then start in gear with the sidestand up. Simple enough to keep the habit of holding the clutch for start-up.

Hey Docc,    Tbh, when I thought I was simply bypassing the safety switch, I didn't look that hard for it the 2nd time, knowing that I needed that little bit to get the bike going, changed the urgency level of the search.

     I pulled out one of my bright LED work lights, and after crawling on the floor for 2 minutes, I now have that little black plug in ,my hand again,lol.

     I've read some of your posts on keeping that area clean and lubed, what would be appropriate, a little dab of silicon grease to lube it up and help hold it in place while I jam the lever and perch back together?

     Tks

      Kelly

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Sounds like a good plan. Doesn't take much grease to keep that together for assembly.

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  • 2 months later...

Well, day of the dead has returned. Not exactly, but the hint is there. Clutch worked without reproach until yesterday (7.300 total miles). 3/4 of the way through an 80 mile trip, the clutch lever did not return completely. Then it would, then it wouldn't. After that, it began dragging as if there was air in the system, but after a rest, seems back to normal. Conflicting signals in the symptoms. No signs of fluid leak and all up top is tight. Reservoir full of clear fluid. I realize that the solution is to dismantle the entire bike, but I rather hope to avoid at least most of that.

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28 minutes ago, po18guy said:

Well, day of the dead has returned. Not exactly, but the hint is there. Clutch worked without reproach until yesterday (7.300 total miles). 3/4 of the way through an 80 mile trip, the clutch lever did not return completely. Then it would, then it wouldn't. After that, it began dragging as if there was air in the system, but after a rest, seems back to normal. Conflicting signals in the symptoms. No signs of fluid leak and all up top is tight. Reservoir full of clear fluid. I realize that the solution is to dismantle the entire bike, but I rather hope to avoid at least most of that.

Another member recently had something similar and it was just the lever sticking. Simple enough to start by removing it and cleaning, lubing the pivot points. Be mindful of the little actuators inside the hole that operate the safety switch.

Mine once split its master cylinder spring to pieces and affected the lever similarly:

IMG_5995.jpg

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And by "dragging", you mean the bike would creep forward even though the lever was pulled fully in?  Ugh, when my Sport did that intermittently it turned into a much bigger deal . . . hopefully you just need a lever service or a master cylinder rebuild.

IMG_2583.JPG.jpeg

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2 hours ago, po18guy said:

Well, day of the dead has returned. Not exactly, but the hint is there. Clutch worked without reproach until yesterday (7.300 total miles). 3/4 of the way through an 80 mile trip, the clutch lever did not return completely. Then it would, then it wouldn't. After that, it began dragging as if there was air in the system, but after a rest, seems back to normal. Conflicting signals in the symptoms. No signs of fluid leak and all up top is tight. Reservoir full of clear fluid. I realize that the solution is to dismantle the entire bike, but I rather hope to avoid at least most of that.

Its not overfilled is it?

Ciao

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I had changed out levers for shorty adjustable levers, but retained the OEM adjustment screw by swapping them over from the MG levers. Months ago, I had a front brake drag (to a stop) until I figured out the brake M/C plunder was not returning far enough to expose the relief port. Quick fix. Did the same with the shorty clutch lever and never the hint of a problem. Until...

So, I have swapped the OEM clutch lever back in. We will see.

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2 hours ago, Lucky Phil said:

Its not overfilled is it?

Ciao

Ooooh! Thanks for that. Gonna check, as the diaphragm on the clutch M/C cap was extended when I unscrewed it. Apparently a vacuum seal with the fluid, which was near the top. Will check the level in tomorrow's 75-80º sunshine.

Am thinking that all of this is payback for teaching some punk in a VW Golf that he was not the fastest machine on the interstate.  Had I been on my GPz500S, ah... I woulda' done the same thing! Coulda' hung with him to about 190 clicks. 

Crap! I'm 68 years old! What am I thinking???

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3 hours ago, docc said:

And by "dragging", you mean the bike would creep forward even though the lever was pulled fully in?  Ugh, when my Sport did that intermittently it turned into a much bigger deal . . . hopefully you just need a lever service or a master cylinder rebuild.

IMG_2583.JPG.jpeg

No way I want to see that!!! It will go in a garage corner and I'll lose interest. Then, some younger dude will be able to fix this dead man's bike.  Am thinking that Phil nailed it, as the reservoir is filled to the max.

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That would awesome if an overfull reservoir could be the issue. (I've never heard of that). Otherwise, easy enough to service the lever and pivot.

Will the lever travel misbehave pulling and releasing it just sitting with the bike off, or does it have to be rolling for it to occur?

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