Gritman Posted October 7, 2014 Author Share Posted October 7, 2014 Cheers Phil. Confirms my thoughts. A potentiometer ain't complex and the voltages forTB balance are pretty close, so either should be able to work. Interesting that Cliff reckons the stock v11 map is a good starting point. Perhaps I'll have a pop at guzzidiag and see what a mess I can make! Learning is half the fun! How's your build going? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luhbo Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Look here for the PF3 output curve (read carefully ): http://www.guzziclub.fi/foorumi/index.php?topic=4127.135 and for comparison: http://ca-cycleworks.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/750x500/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/p/f/pf09_printout.jpg Similar enough to give it a try. You would have done so anyway, wouldn't you? Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritman Posted October 8, 2014 Author Share Posted October 8, 2014 Hey! good work there Hubert, tho the swedish was harder than a guzzi wiring diagram to get my head around Both TPS start and end at similar voltages and are pretty close at any given throttle opening. I would expect that any minor variance can be dialled out with the fuelling map..... more reason for continued naive optimism. Its what the project needs at this stage! Also, have solved the niggle of the petcock fouling the TB - until today I wasn't aware that the electric version had been superseded by a manual item which has a shorter body, with the added advantage of being cheap; my second most favourite price! Phil is spared this pleasure as he has cheated by using an in-tank pump and filter. Waiting for a weekend of spanner twirlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky Phil Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Hey guys all good info thanks. I'm still rebuilding the heads for my engine but work and family commitments are making the progress slow. Ciao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritman Posted May 29, 2017 Author Share Posted May 29, 2017 Well Good Morning Campers! A few things have happened since my last post - over 2 years ago! In the intervening period, the project has become a rolling project, mot'd and on the road each summer, though largely for shakedown testing and setting up. # Now its just about ready, goes like a rocket, and from an unbiased perspective, looks gorgeous. The paintwork has been changed - b&w was only a stopgap; stock silencers changed for shiny Mistral megas, stock hugger - which must rank as one of the ugliest bits of plastic ever, and it didnt keep muck off the shock - changed for a suzuki rm250 item; front mudguard changed... To use the huge void left by the airbox, I have relocated the coils, horns reg/rect and temp sensor there which allows a lot of wiring to be concealed. A new old stock internal pump tank was acquired further tidying up the under tank area. The rear subframe was extended 25mm rearwards and upwards to ensure that the triple clamp did not foul the tank, and the lines of the tank/seat unit remained unaffected. The bracket holding up the front of the tank was beefed up to make ensure no movement During the process, a lot of painting, plating and coating went on and the steering head, swingarm, wheel bearings were changed and a Roper plate installed; new clutch friction and driven plates installed with new springs after failing to secure a RAM item. I'm now getting to grips with Guzzidiag to sort out the last 2% though she is already well set up and quite a pleasure to ride. I do apologise for the chaotic nature of this diary. Its quite a fair reflection of my life!! If anyone has specific queries, I'll be pleased to address them. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docc Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 Wow, Gritman! Make that, **WOW** ! ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
czakky Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 That just looks like a bunch of fun! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowRyter Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swooshdave Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 I thought the reason they didn't use that engine in the V11 is because the engines were't lasting? Something about the alloy they were using? Also what is the power output from the V10 vs V11? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docc Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 Those engines were really expensive to produce. Plus, the Guzzi *cogniscenti* of the day were largely unconvinced of the added value. Head alloys became a significant development issue producing the 1064cc 2-valve big block with the Crane cam. So, perhaps, the V10 head alloys were an issue? What a great motor (the V10) for those with the gumption to take it on! The Vee-eleven-slash-ten! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritman Posted May 30, 2017 Author Share Posted May 30, 2017 This engine has been a sleeper all its life, with occasional moments of recognition/glory. Having owned, run and modified most large block Guzzi engines over some 20-odd years, I feel I have a pretty informed opinion of their characteristics and development, though I haven't ridden a tuned V11 lump -yet - I believe the V10 was the best motor to come out of Mandello. All Guzzi motors suffer terribly at the hands of the regulators and are pretty much strangled to death to get through emissions. Our work is to free up their airways and set them up with fuel efficiency as the priority instead of emissions, and liberate the beast! Having put about 40,000 miles on these engines I can assure you that reliability isn't an issue - if you replace/upgrade the oil pump! Being a low-volume production with early FI its no surprise that 'cogniscenti' weren't convinced. Early maps on Centauro/Daytona were pretty awful. Their premature demise has been the source of much speculation, but the head alloy seems to be a consistent factor from different sources. I gather that the recipe was misplaced and rather than try to replicate it, MG just shrugged and gave up! As far as performance goes, there is not a great deal in it if you go by the numbers from production machines. Daytona/Centauro - 95bhp, 88nM (RS 105bhp), V11 90bhp, 91nM. However, the V10 is quite tuneable and the numbers reflect this. You will all doubtless know of monsters converted to 1225 or even 1300 producing up to 150bhp at the wheel, though these beasts have considerable work done opening up the oil pickup and delivery channels, adding a high volume pump and a cooling oil spray to the underside of the pistons and beefing up the main bearings. Being an air-cooled motor, cooling is the thing that effectively limits power; if you exceed 100bhp/l you will need to seriously look at the cooling of any motor. For me the glory of the V10 is its performance from 5K upwards. Starting as a surge it becomes an unstoppable torrent, gaining momentum all the way to the red line. I'm not as young as I was and holding on to the thing at 7K is hard work even in the sub-100bhp state I'm currently at. I could always use a few more ponies, but my focus is on rideability rather than absolute power. Sticking my neck out here, but if MG had looked into oil cooling the heads (there is already a cooler on V10's) perhaps the alloy wouldn't be so critical, and emissions would have been easier to hit. Then perhaps MG could have a sports bike or two in their model range I have just sent some bin files to Guzzidiag for conversion so that the fuelling can be finally sorted so expect many queries from me in that thread!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JesterGrin_1 Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 Oil Cooler and just an FYI there is an Oil Thermostat available that does not take up a bunch of room. They are mainly used for High Performance VW Type 1 engines. Other then that I will have to reiterate what Docc said and that is simply WOW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve S Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 Nice work Gritman having built a couple of V11 specials in the past I've got another one in my head that needs to be done, problem is after owning 10 V11s over the past few years I can't find a reasonably priced donor bike in the UK, been looking for 6 months but they are all asking silly money like the one on Ebay at the moment for £9k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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