Installing a Roper Sloppage Sheet

[Guest ratchethack]

The angle thing will no longer be an issue if you install Pete's plate. It has a small oval hole that the dipstick must go through to get a reading. If the stick is through that hole you cannot be off the correct angle by enough degrees to make a difference.

Touché, Pete -- and Greg! The simple, elegant solution.

[Ryland3210]

Interesting points, Ryland. My own experience is that under nearly identical conditions of temperature, angle of the block relative to horizontal, etc. that using volume measure alone to refill after oil draining can be spot-on one day and considerably over or under-filled the next. <_ i concluded long ago that it the amount of oil coming out varies due to so many factors net effects are least by me still poorly understood. imagine galleries for whatever reason may remain filled despite my draining efforts or not. src="%7B___base_url___%7D/uploads/emoticons/default_knownothing.gif" alt=":huh2:">

 

...

Hm. As far as I'm concerned, I don't care much about the volume of oil in there. Again -- if it's within a few cm of the limits the factory put on the dipstick, I'm willing to assume the lubrication and cooling needs of the motor are bring met (barring wheelies, drag-strip launches, crashes, etc. -- and without a Roper plate), and for practical purposes (as noted above), the volume is irrelevant.

 

BAA, TJM, & YMMV

 

Hi Ratchethack,

 

My comment on temperature was a bit of my tongue in cheek humor. I really don't believe the coefficient on thermal expansion is a significant factor. I managed to resist the temptation to specify the relative humidity and barometric pressure.

 

I don't understand the value of measuring the amount of oil coming out. That will vary depending on consumption since the last oil change.

 

The reason I cared about oil volume was only a means to an end, calibrating the dipstick. It was a one time only experiment. The logical place to start was to see where the full mark ended up when carefully draining, then adding 3.5 liters as Guzzi specifies. Having done that, as I said, I'll of course be using my calibrated dipstick to maintain oil level henceforth. Had the results been above the gasket or suspciously low, I would have done some more investigating. As it happens, the 3.5 liters was near ideal, absent a sloppage sheet. Right now a sloppage sheet is not an option for me, as the warrantee is still in effect. If I get one, I'll probably raise the oil level as Pete has suggested.

 

I was careful to avoid double dipping, and took several measurements. I can get as obsessive as I feel is necessary to "do it right the first time" so I never have to do it again.

 

Glad to hear how Pete's sloppage sheet guides the dipstick. That's eliminates the potential source of a major error.

[rockers]

I put mine on at 0400 hrs Sunday morning, before my Sunday ride. For anyone who's interested, here's some words and pix on what's involved:

 

Preliminaries

 

1) Drain the oil. I did it the night before so more of the oil would drip off the parts I would be playing with. If you will be changing oil and filter, remove the filter, too. I had just changed oil two weeks prior, so I'm reusing the oil and filter.

 

2) Inspect the sloppage plate, and if necessary, debur it.

 

 

Here's the plate. It's a very nice piece that's even inscribed with the name of Pete's company, so that when some archeologist unearths your V11 ten thousand years from now, they'll read the inscription and surmise that the Aussies ruled all the world in the year 2006.

 

 

There were no real burrs on the one Pete sent me, but whatever cutting process used left a minor raised ring around the circumferences of some of the holes. The only holes on which this could possible matter are the ones for the oil journals. I used a flat file to gnaw them down. This shows it about halfway through the gnawing. Clean the plate thoroughly afterward.

 

3) Using a 19mm wrench, loosen and remove the three oil lines that enter the sump.

 

 

4) Remove the screw that fastens the sidestand support to the upper sump, as shown in the fuzzy photo above. Loosen also the big bolt that holds the sidestand mount to the crankcase. I have a crashbar, so I had to loosen the big silver neut shown, which fastens on the crashbar.

 

5) Remove the lower sump by removing the screws that fasten it. If you lack an air ratchet, or (like me) can't stand the racket made by air tools early in the morning, let me introduce you to my little friend, the perfect tool for this job: Mr. Torq-It. He's great for taking out and replacing all those sump screws.

 

 

6) Loosen the upper sump by removing the screws around its inner perimeter. Some of them are shown below, as is another of my little little friends: Mr. Hoseclamp. This one is best friends with Billy Bob's oil filter, but there's another Mr. Hoseclamp out there who wants to be your oil filter's friend, too.

 

 

7) Loosen the four screws that hold fasten all the plumbing for the oil system (two are shown above). Support the oil filter and the rest of the guts as you are removing the last screw, so it doesn't tear free of its threads under weight of the upper sump.

 

 

8) Set the upper sump carefully on a bench, supporting it if necessary to keep it from tiliting and spilling the oil out of you filter, as shown above.

 

 

9) If the old gasket is torn, replace it, and then top it with the sloppage plate and add another gasket on top, as shown above. Those lobes of the gasket that extend toward the center are the most important part of the gasket and need to be in perfect shape because they seal the pressurized oil journals. Make sure they are in top shape. A leak from one of the journals will be internal, so you won't see it. A small leak won't be catastrophic, but a big leak will be. I do not use gasket goo for these gaskets. If you insist on using gasket goo around these journals, use it very sparingly (so you do not plug a journal) or use an anaerobic sealer so it will not harden in the journal if it gets in there. As the photo shows, the sloppage tray is a good fit and fills well all the space toward the back of the sump (right side of photo), so it should keep more oil near the pickup during drag-race starts.

 

 

10) Time to install the upper sump and sloppage plate. It is vital that the gaskets that surround the oil journals stay in place during installation. One good way to ensure this is to slide one bolt into place at both front and rear journal blocks before lifting the assembly into place, as shown above. Lift it into place and start threading the two screws until they can support the assembly. Then, insert the other two screws and thread them in partway. It is best not to fasten them until you have started threading in all the perimeter screws. Go ahead and thread in these perimeter screws loosely, then tighten the oil-journal screws, and lastly tighten the perimeter screws.

 

11) If the lower sump gasket is torn, replace it, and then lift the lower sump into place and tighten its perimeter screws.

 

 

12) Hook up the three ol lines and tighten them. The two at the front are often routed so tightly that they rub together and onto the alternator cover. As you can see above, mine were abrading each other and the alternator cover. Take this opportunity to separate them before you tighten the fittings, so they do not wer through.

 

 

12) By adding the sloppage plate, you've lowered the upper sump by about 2.5mm, between the thickness of the plate and extra gasket. Because of this, you may need to relieve the lower perimeter of the hole in the sidestand mount. In my case, I had to remove about 0.5mm and did it with a Dremel and burr, as shown in the fuzzy photo above. Tighten both the screw into the sump and the bolt above it that fastens the sidestand mount to the engine block.

 

 

13) The thin, silver "Roper Line" betwixt engine block and upper sump is the only external cue that that plate's in there. Check your work once-over, add engine oil, and go for a ride.

 

I added oil to halfway between full and add, as checked by the Guzzi method, meaning with the bike level and dipstick screwed all the way in (this is about where iit had been when I experienced oil starvation under acceleration before) and then rode it yesterday on a long ride two-up.Tonight I'll try some full-on launches while watching the oil-pressure gauge to see if the sloppage tray does its job.

 

Whatever the result, afterwards, I'm gonna add oil to the full mark as checked by the safer method of just inserting the dipstick to the top of the threads.

 

Thanks again, Pete!

[pete roper]

I note this has been viewed again.

 

If anyone is interested I have just had another run made. I know some people made enquiries before but my desktop which contained all my emails, contacts etc. shat itself lavishly about three months ago and I lost everything.

 

If people are still wanting a plate I have the new V-III plate in stock as of now. Got half a dozen ready to go if anyone wants.

 

Pete

[gstallons]

This plate (along with putting a hose clamp on the oil filter) is the most important product you will ever install on your bike.

[GuzziMoto]

Yes, Pete. I would be interested in one for the wife's V11.

 

Michael

[JesterGrin_1]

Greg Field Thank You so much for the wright up and outstanding picture tutorial of the Roper Plate installation.  This looks to be old news but there will always be Newbies looking to maintain and or improve upon there either newly acquired Moto Guzzi V11 or old time riders of the same that were not aware of such a good product that will help there beloved Moto Guzzi V11 to live a long happy life thus allowing us to do the same upon the metal steed. As I will be sure to use this valuable information soon.

[docc]

Greg Field Thank You so much for the wright up and outstanding picture tutorial of the Roper Plate installation.  This looks to be old news but there will always be Newbies looking to maintain and or improve upon there either newly acquired Moto Guzzi V11 or old time riders of the same that were not aware of such a good product that will help there beloved Moto Guzzi V11 to live a long happy life thus allowing us to do the same upon the metal steed. As I will be sure to use this valuable information soon.

This post is also in this thread, pinned in How-to:

http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=9425

 

Thanks for dredging this one up!

 

(sure miss hearing from Greg Field; gotta love that pull-cord hex driver!)

[Chuck]

Beaver, the Turnip farmer, and Greg Field at the Nationals in Oregon this year..

2016-07-02_10-17-58 by Charles Stottlemyer, on Flickr

Greg's had some serious health issues, and this was his first "ride" in a long time.

[docc]

Greg Field's book "Moto Guzzi Big Twins" is a must-have for everyone. The interviews with Umberto Todero and John Wittner are priceless.

 

Greg, single-handedly, set the record straight on the whole "tractor motor" bullcrap that was, apparently, erroneously started by Mick Walker (IMO).

 

Best regards to  Greg!

[Bingbong]

Hi all,

I will finally get my slosh plate installed along with a lot of other work in the next few weeks, I wanted to give my tech the low down on installing these and thought I had watched a great "how to" video that I was going to forward a link to. But cannot find it now. Can anyone assist? or confirm I wasn't dreaming it..   lol 

thanks

happy new riding year..

 

[docc]

Greg Field's tutorial with images is here:

https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/topic/9425-installing-a-roper-slopper/

And @swooshdave's post with the link to his video:

https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/topic/20671-roper-plate-redux/?do=findComment&comment=242469

 

[Bingbong]

wow!! fantastic..   thanks very much 

[Lucky Phil]

Missed out a whole process of fitting the plate up to the crankcase. I hope there's a gasket between the roper plate and the engine crankcase, doesn't seem to be from the side image. 

 

Phil

[pete roper]

Yeah, gaskets both sides Phil. Might be a bit messy otherwise....