guzzijack Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 I'll certainly be dropping the sump plate and installing a clamp on any of the V11's I work on, all, of course, as part of my cunning scheme to fleece my customers and buy that boat Pete Oh!....... I get the picture . Now that you've sewn up the world distribution rights on Guzzi filter sized hose clamps suddenly you're all in favour of 'insisting' that all and sundry should use this new technology <_> Surely a better plan for the home mechanic would be the careful placement of a 6" 'Hagan' through the lateral axis of the filter so that it locked it against the thermostat housing to prevent unspinning? Such a mechanical sacrifice would surely keep the bad Ju Ju away and prevent smaller 'Hagans' being attracted to the tyres? Whaddaya think Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Hagan Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Oh!....... I get the picture . Now that you've sewn up the world distribution rights on Guzzi filter sized hose clamps suddenly you're all in favour of 'insisting' that all and sundry should use this new technology <_> Surely a better plan for the home mechanic would be the careful placement of a 6" 'Hagan' through the lateral axis of the filter so that it locked it against the thermostat housing to prevent unspinning? Such a mechanical sacrifice would surely keep the bad Ju Ju away and prevent smaller 'Hagans' being attracted to the tyres? Whaddaya think Graham Whoa. I'm kinda worried cuz I actually understand that ... in theory. 'Course, I can see an issue with execution, followed by sad-faced pics of a hole in the engine case and "helpful" posts about JB Weld! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badmotogoozer Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Well, I'm not naive enough to believe that only idiots and morons have had their filters come loose. For whatever reason, filters HAVE been coming loose lately. I can't see a downside to the filter clamp, especially if one of Pete's sloppers is installed. In the unlikelyhood that it (clamp) did come off - seems to me it would be kept clear of the munching bits by the slopper. And if no slopper - where is it going to go?? Gravity will keep it in the bottom of the pan until it sloshes up to the magnet on the plug, where it will remain until next change. I can't imagine a force while riding that would cause it to jump out of the oil and into the moving bits. Too big to get sucked into the oil pick up. A bit of "belt and suspenders" seems warranted in this case as the damage from a loosened filter far outweighs a two dollar clamp. I really don't get all the hostility over this. I'm with Pete and Greg - have not heard one reasonable argument to not lock down the filter. Rj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzzi323 Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Unless the hose clamp were to break in two places, it'll just fall to the bottom of the pan but still be captive around the oil filter. I don't believe there's enough room for it to get out. As for the issue of the filter not being tightened in the first place. I've been working on bikes for 21 years. Only the first 6 or so professionally. Since then I only work on my stuff having done the routine maintenance on all of my bikes totalling more than 300,00 miles. That's a lot of oil filters put on. I have the proper filter wrench. I tightened my filter with it. I currently have bearing shells and rod bolts on order because this happened to me. A $3 clamp and a bit more work installing the filter will be in my future maintenance routine. I know I'm just one more 'guy on the internet with an opinion' but that's my johnk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Field Posted November 9, 2006 Author Share Posted November 9, 2006 Unless the hose clamp were to break in two places, it'll just fall to the bottom of the pan but still be captive around the oil filter. I don't believe there's enough room for it to get out. As for the issue of the filter not being tightened in the first place. I've been working on bikes for 21 years. Only the first 6 or so professionally. Since then I only work on my stuff having done the routine maintenance on all of my bikes totalling more than 300,00 miles. That's a lot of oil filters put on. I have the proper filter wrench. I tightened my filter with it. I currently have bearing shells and rod bolts on order because this happened to me. A $3 clamp and a bit more work installing the filter will be in my future maintenance routine. I know I'm just one more 'guy on the internet with an opinion' but that's my johnk Some of you guys still think I make this shit up . . . alas, I do not. John: I just want to be clear on this: I do have the rod bolts for your repair. It's the guy who called yesterday who may be SOL, 'cause I'm having a difficult time finding the fourth one I need for his repair. The rod shells I have found, outside the US Guzzi network. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzzi323 Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 John: I just want to be clear on this: I do have the rod bolts for your repair. It's the guy who called yesterday who may be SOL, 'cause I'm having a difficult time finding the fourth one I need for his repair. The rod shells I have found, outside the US Guzzi network. Thank you for the clarification Greg. I'm not too concerned about the timeframe on getting the parts. If it takes a few weeks I'm a big boy, I can deal with that. I'm just thankful there are dealers who are willing to put up with/work around the problems with Guzzi North America to help us keep our bikes running. johnk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belfastguzzi Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Is Belfast visiting Chicago? It's Scottish ye eejit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete roper Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Is it conceivable that this rash of loose filters coincides with a plummeting global common sense index?! I'd love to think that this was just an outbreak of rabid 'gloidism but if that was the case then surely the idiocy would be manifesting itself in a broad variety of ways rather than a sudden rash of filters loosening? The "Done up finger tight" theory has appeal but I just can't see it given the suddeness of the appearance of the problem. I went and had a really good squizz at the sealing gasket on a new filter yesterday and I have to say that I can see absolutely no difference in design or construction of the filter or the gasket. Could the use of a new or different material for the gasket perhaps be the problem?? . Anyway, taking the sump off a V11 is so easy I really can't justify to myself the risk of not doing it on customers' bikes. It won't change the cost of the service and it will give me peace of mind so I'll do it that way from now on and use a clamp, at least until we can nut out some definitive explanation as to what has been happening. Better safe than sorry and all that. If you drop the sump you can drain out all the water too and even here in desert-like Bungendore they always seem to have condensation aplenty in their sumps! Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ratchethack Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 I'd love to think that this was just an outbreak of rabid 'gloidism but if that was the case then surely the idiocy would be manifesting itself in a broad variety of ways rather than a sudden rash of filters loosening? Pete, we've just had our National manifestation of idiocy. When were the last National elections in Oz?!?!?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaput Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 My "global idiocy" self grenaded on itself at sunrise coming down off the Cherhalla Skyway. Bad place to get caught up with this problem and see a flickering oil light followed by metal on metal noises. So I can relate with Guzzi323. I'm no professional but this is my third Guzzi and I've tightened a few filters in that time. If Greg knows about 4 self imploding Guzzis due to a loose filter we can now make it 5 so I guess that makes it a global epidemic. Kaput (means broken in German - get it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete roper Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Pete, we've just had our National manifestation of idiocy. <_> When were the last National elections in Oz?!?!?!? Consider yourselves lucky! We have three year terms federally and a government rarely goes to term so we get the whole 9 yards every 2 and 1/2 years. Then we also have the state elections, also 3 years in most states, and local government elections to contend with and yes, they are ALL dropkicks! Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badmotogoozer Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Pete, we've just had our National manifestation of idiocy. <_> One man's idiocy is another man's awakening. Rj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan M Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Heard of another V11 Sport today dead because the filter backed off. That makes three in the last month and two in the last week that I personally know of. He, too, called needing rod shells and bolts. Guzzi is out of rod bearings and rod bolts. Coincidence? You decide. Tighten the filter well, and watch your oil light. It is also considered wise by some to use a hose clamp to be double-dog sure it won't come loose without your blessing. Greg, just curious, are the failures you've seen factory (UFI) filters or another brand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Field Posted November 9, 2006 Author Share Posted November 9, 2006 I don't know what type of filters, except for my frined Ken's, which was a UFI. His was on a California 1100, not a V11 SPort. I didn't ask the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waspp Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 Exactly. After near 30 years in the car business I can tell you that filters that "come loose" were always loose. Loose, leaky filters that I've seen were usually put on by the car's owner or some snot-nosed kid at a quick oil change place. The only bright side is that if you are not qualified to tighten an oil filter fully then natural selection is probably going to see that you are removed from the gene pool after you decide to do your own brake service. Ditto that, I can't see a filter backing off unless it was installed by a weekend mechanic as he was pouring over his owners manuel looking for proper installation methods and torque settings! Were these filters installed at a shop ...MI or homeowner mr goodwrench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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