Fuel quality - Fuel additives - Top Tier Gasoline - (in the USA); should we use it in our Vs?

[p6x]

My V11 Le Mans 2004, allegedly 38k miles pings under hard throttle opening. My V11 Quota, 38k miles too, does not.

In previous discussions about octane quantity in US Gas, and using 87 octanes instead of 93 octanes (RON+MON)/2, I thought my engine pinging came from low octanes or poor mapping. After a tune-up, and new map for my Stayintune mufflers, the pinging is still there.

I don't know what is the real mileage of my Le Mans, since I purchased it with 8,800 miles on an odometer that was no longer working.

Today, I have 30,000 more miles on it.

I suspect I have a lot of carbon deposit on my valves. I started looking around for fuel additives and literature about the so-called Top Tier fuel label that you find in the USA.

I found this study about fuel by AAA: https://www.aaa.com/AAA/common/AAR/files/Fuel-Quality-Full-Report.pdf

My question to you experts, is, should I take down the top end of my Le Mans and clean the valves, or should I use a fuel additive which should long term improve the situation.

Are any of you using a fuel additive?

Are any of you using Top Tier gas in your motorcycle?

I use Costco Kirkland signature gasoline, which is in the list of TopTier gas.

Should I open the top ends and remove the carbon, or should I trust an additive, and if yes, do you have any recommendation?

I realize that opening the engine is the most effective solution. Just getting opinions and input.

[p6x]

@audiomick

Is this tutorial good enough for my V11? mute the video....

 

[audiomick]

4 hours ago, p6x said:

mute the video....

Why would you want to do that? The music is fantastic...

Seriously, though: the video is from Stein-Dinse, so I would be inclined to trust it. It looks good to me, but I haven't had the heads off mine yet, so I can't say for sure. Perhaps @pete roper or someone else with appropriate experience can comment.

The texts that appear in the video mean, more or less, this:

Take out the spark plugs and undo all the valve cover screws.
If the valve cover sticks, it can be loosened with a couple of gentle taps with a hammer
Loosen off the valve play adjustment screws, and turn the crank to TDC to take the pressure off the rockers
Undo the bolts holding the rocker shaft, and remove the shafts. Attention: take care not to lose the washers when taking out the shafts.
Remove the push-rods
Remove the "stopper"
Loosen and remove all six head bolts, and remove the rocker block
Remove the oil line
Remove the head and the head gasket
Remove the cylinder block
Put something (a rag, for instance) under the piston to prevent small parts falling into the crankcase
Remove the clip on the piston pin
Remove the piston pin and then the piston

 

Hope that helps.

 

Edited May 17 by audiomick

[po18guy]

Some insist that lean mixtures lead to pinging. Dirty injectors can certainly cause that. As the mileage racks up, the injectors will certainly pick up some crud. I use 92 octane and regular spritzes of Lucas or RedLine  F.I. cleaner and no problems - but I am only look at 12K on the bike. These are essentially 1930s Pratt & Whitney combustion chambers and need some octane to function as intended. As to carbon, a port fuel injected engine should not suffer from excess intake carbon like the direct injection engines do. Maybe a cocktail of FI cleaner and octane booster will help.

[audiomick]

38 minutes ago, po18guy said:

... regular spritzes...

Nitpicking: if you're going to use German words, do it right. Not "spritzes", "Spritzer".

[Tomchri]

Not saying you shoud try it, water in a good pump can with fine spraying possibilitys does for sure the cleaning job well. Look how clean a cylinder look if you have to change a headgasket.  Yes I have done it a couple of times. See what comes out of the muffler of an old tired V8.   Caution is #1, we don't like bend rods.  Seems your bike is on the run for quite some miles, so woudn't think to much carbon build. Thinking you are trying to get the best gas available all the time.  Did the heads on my 1100 Sport at 95000km, not much carbon.   Some here like sea foam treatment. 

Cheers Tom.

[pete roper]

Have you performed a full tune up on it?

[po18guy]

3 hours ago, audiomick said:

Nitpicking: if you're going to use German words, do it right. Not "spritzes", "Spritzer".

Aber Ich spreche kein Deutsch!

[PJPR01]

I find that Top Tier gasoline does make the Guzzis run smoother...it's more notable on the Norge and Griso...haven't "felt" it as much on the Scura.

Occasionally I'll run some Marvel mystery oil thru it or some LiquiMoly valve cleaner...but to be honest, I don't notice anything materially different.

I have had my injectors reconditioned on the Scura and that was well worth it, they had a degraded spray pattern, and afterwards were perfect again.  I recall Gstallons recommended it, so I did it and also bought a set of cheaper Ebay sourced injectors which also work just fine on my Norge.

Are you noticing some degradation in "smoothness" or performance lately that causes you to want to open this up, or just looking for a fun project.

It occurs to me it would be good for us to have a small Spine Raid in Navasota and compare the LeMans to the Scura in terms of engine smoothness to see if they are any different...yours should be better being a 2004 vs. my 2002 ancient Scura that I took out for a fun 150 mile sunset romp today.

[docc]

 Navasota Spine Raid  has a nice ring to it !       

[PJPR01]

Out scouting out sites on a nice warm pre-summer day!  The bike always puts a smile on my face even when parked!

Got one zerk fitting lubed today on the Scura after putting fresh grease in the motorcycle trailer wheel bearings, now have to work on the other two "awkward" ones with a needle attachment coming soon.

Edited May 18 by PJPR01

[Pressureangle]

My observations are that the engine is very sensitive to fuel quality. I've seen a 10% difference in fuel economy between tanks across the country- octane is ping resistance, but it doesn't correlate directly with energy content.
I've never heard my own engine ping, but I have a MyECU with the ignition base map having been worked out long before I tuned the fuel. 
A couple points- Octane obviously is the primary indicator of ping resistance; do you always use premium, or are you running 87 ever? At what RPM are you having the ping? 
Oil of any sort always reduces octane. Have you any indication of oil consumption? Though I don't experience it, I would expect a hot engine, such as having waited a long light on a hot day, to ping at lower (<4k) rpm with heavy throttle. 
As a matter of course, when I know I'll be riding less than aggressively I'll run a tank through with Marvel Mystery Oil to wash off any meaningful carbon deposits. I will also periodically run a bottle of Chevron Techron, between the two additives it keeps the combustion chambers and fuel injectors as clean as possible. 
I discovered upon having my injectors cleaned that the flow was down considerably from stock, and very different from side to side as well which made tuning impossible. 
 

[p6x]

On 5/17/2025 at 6:14 PM, pete roper said:

Have you performed a full tune up on it?

Yes;

Done by MPH, including a custom map for the exhaust system. This got rid of the 3000 rpm hiccup, and got my fuel consumption in line with the rest.

[p6x]

I rode for the Motorcycle Tour of Texas yesterday.

447 miles loop in South East of Texas.

I refueled twice the V11, and both times, no Premium fuel available. Only regular gas at pumps that are clearly showing their age. This is something I have started to notice in the more rural parts of Texas. The small towns with populations inferior to 1000 individuals.

Many closed down gas stations; the surviving one being completely run down. As soon as you leave the most traveled paths, using the back roads, gas stations look decrepit and for many, only two choices, Diesel or Regular.

TopTier fuel is not even in play.

In these areas, they don't have premium fuel because the cars used there don't require it.

As before, there wasn't any noticeable difference burning 87 Octane gas in my Le Mans.

[p6x]

On 5/17/2025 at 9:07 PM, PJPR01 said:

Are you noticing some degradation in "smoothness" or performance

No change in terms of smoothness or performance, but I never really brutalize the Le Mans. I always keep in the back of my mind that we are riding motorcycles which have at least 20 years of age.

I used the Techron fuel cleaner from Chevron before my Sunday ride.

I did notice a change. When I release the throttle, there aren't any more pops. Those pops only appeared after the new map was installed. The Quota exhibits the same pops on throttle release following the remap. It was not doing that when I drove it from Peoria AZ to H'town.

Placebo effect?

I wish they got rid of that 10% Ethanol requirement that no longer makes sense.