ECU Trouble shooting

[Guest str8films]

OK, I'm new to this common problem. Good to know I'm not the first to do the wrench across the hot post to the ECU box. Wondering if there is a way to bench test the ECU to see if I did smoke it? Could I have fried the Relay in the process and not the ECU; keeping the bike from starting? We're talking a '00 V11 Sport Magni. If it helps, the bike is green.

 

After installing the battery and wrestling with the leads, I made the blunder. Now, when I hit the starter, the relay clicks, but I get a whole lot of nothing after that. That's why I thought maybe the Replay went bad....or is that wishful thinking.

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Matt

Seattle

[luhbo]

If you can hear the fuel pump, then it should be something different.

 

Hubert

 

 

OK, I'm new to this common problem.  Good to know I'm not the first to do the wrench across the hot post to the ECU box.  Wondering if there is a way to bench test the ECU to see if I did smoke it?  Could I have fried the Relay in the process and not the ECU; keeping the bike from starting?  We're talking a '00 V11 Sport Magni.  If it helps, the bike is green.

 

After installing the battery and wrestling with the leads, I made the blunder.  Now, when I hit the starter, the relay clicks, but I get a whole lot of nothing after that.  That's why I thought maybe the Replay went bad....or is that wishful thinking. <_>

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Matt

Seattle

85045[/snapback]

[callison]

I've done the battery to ECU thing as well and did no damage to the ECU. The ECU case is ground so of course throwing battery voltage on to it makes for a pretty good spark. However, unless you maintain that current to the case long enough to arc weld something or burn up the ground lead on the case I don't think you will have damaged any of the electronics of the ECU.

 

The starter circuit is electrically separate from the ECU, so that isn't the first place to start checking. As a first step, make sure the battery has a full charge. Then check all of the fuses to make sure they're okay. Then mark your relays so you can return them to the original position easily and try swapping them around. Depending upon what your particular bike has for relays, they may all be identical or there may be one different (the headlight relay), hence the need to mark them to avoid confusion and to not mix up good with bad when testing. You can use any relay in the V11 Sport in any position except that the headlight will not work if you have the wrong one in that spot when done. No damage results, so you can just put the correct one back in that position. Now try swapping relays around to see if anything changes.

 

There are a few other things to check but probably the easiest thing to do (for us) at this point is to have you give us a complete list of what lights work on the dash, is sidestand up when you try, the clutch switch working etc. Also if you have any modifications to the wiring bypassing anything.

[Dan M]

OK, I'm new to this common problem.  Good to know I'm not the first to do the wrench across the hot post to the ECU box.  Wondering if there is a way to bench test the ECU to see if I did smoke it?  Could I have fried the Relay in the process and not the ECU; keeping the bike from starting?  We're talking a '00 V11 Sport Magni.  If it helps, the bike is green.

 

After installing the battery and wrestling with the leads, I made the blunder.  Now, when I hit the starter, the relay clicks, but I get a whole lot of nothing after that.  That's why I thought maybe the Replay went bad....or is that wishful thinking. <_>

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Matt

Seattle

85045[/snapback]

 

Very unlikely that you hurt the ECU or anything else for that matter. Look close to see of all of the wires are connected to the new battery. Maybe one eyelet slipped down and didn't get attached when you hooked things back up.

[dlaing]

If it helps, the bike is green.

85045[/snapback]

Wasn't there a rolling stones song, "I see green bike and I want to paint it black" or was that BelfastGuzzi taunting Van?

I suspect your ECU is fine.

I don't think you toasted a relay or fuse, probably just forgot to attach the line from the battery to the starter....or you discharged the battery a little too much when making fireworks(possibly damaging the battery permanently).

You may need to purchase one of these fine chargers:

(If you are using a Yuasa, you are not likely limited to these. But the Guzzi Spark battery and the Hawker Odyssey require these chargers, or the dilligence of not exceeding 14.7V and not charging for too long, but still getting it to fully charge. In other words, get on of the below chargers)

 

TecMate AccuMate Pro 12V-7A-S Motion Pro Inc. 650-594-9600 (aka optimate) http://www.batterymart.com/p-ACC-12V7A-S.html $86.95++

 

Xenotronix SX 90-1 12V, 6A Xenotronix 800-624-9366 (aka Odyssey Optimiser)

http://www.gotbatteries.com/items.asp?para.../CH301/34S201S2 $99.95++

 

Motocell™ 693601 12V, 3A Custom Chrome 800-729-3332

 

Battery Defender ACC-1206WB 12V, 3A BatteryMart.com 800-405-2121

 

Also Hawker??? is developing an Odyssey Ultimizer to be released second quarter 2006...see http://www.odysseyfactory.com/

[Guest str8films]

Thanks Guys. As far as the inventory of what's what:

 

-All lights on dash work correctly

-Headlight comes on and goes off when the starter button is hit

-Running Power Commander Chip

-All Fuses are Good

-Fuel pump spools up w/ the ignition turned on and clutch in

-Power to the PC chip

-Fuel in the tank

-New Westco battery with nearly 13v

-Kick stand up and clutch switch working properly

-The bike is dirty from getting from a bunch of riding.

-Tabs expired...just need to put the new ones on.

 

I'll try switching out different relays. That may do the trick. You guys recall how to bench test a relay to check if it is good?

 

I'll be back. Thanks again for the support.

 

Matt

[jrt]

Did you check that all the wires are back on the battery? There's several...so could one have fallen down into that tiny space behind the battery?

 

 

Do you have a VOM? you could check to see if you are getting current to the starter when you hit the switch (unlikely...but hey, it's an idea).

 

 

 

[edit- oops- sorry I didn't read Dan's post]

[Cliff]

Remove the power commander until you have the bike running.

[Guest str8films]

I didn't check the voltage at the Starter. Good idea. I'll also try taking the Power Commander out of the loop and see if that works too. I'll work out all of these little things and report back later. Thanks team.

 

Matt

'00 V11 Sport Magni

'94 R100GSPD

'54 AJS 18CS

[callison]

That's a good point about the battery connections. The starter solenoid is powered by the starting circuit but the starter itself has a lead directly to the battery positive terminal.

[Guest str8films]

OK, still no go here in West Seattle. I would have gone to VME tonight otherwise. I did get the starter to "click" a couple of times. Sounds like it engages the flywheel but then there is a whole lot of nothing. Here's what I got:

 

-I went through the relays. They all seem to be good. Switched them out for each other and got the same results all the time. So I know they are good.

 

-Checked voltage at the starter. It is good. No corrosion on the starter lead, everything is clean and tight.

 

-I have any where from 12.8v to 13.5 depending on how much I've been trying to kick it.

 

-Ground is good and solid. I even tried making a better ground through some allegator clips, but it didn't help.

 

-Power Commander chip is out of the loop.

 

My new hypothesis is that maybe the starter is bad? I might pull it out and bench test it tomorrow. Any other ideas?

 

thanks.

 

Matt

[luhbo]

OK, still no go here in West Seattle.  I would have gone to VME tonight otherwise.  I did get the starter to "click" a couple of times.  Sounds like it engages the flywheel but then there is a whole lot of nothing.  Here's what I got:

........

Matt

85218[/snapback]

 

Try this. Remove the green starter cover, press the starter button, hold it, and when you here the solenoid click then give the starter a boost with your favorite hammer or at least the one you have at hand.

 

This cured mine once.

 

Hubert

 

And for sure you made sure that your battery is good, didn't you?

[Dan M]

OK, still no go here in West Seattle.  I would have gone to VME tonight otherwise.  I did get the starter to "click" a couple of times.  Sounds like it engages the flywheel but then there is a whole lot of nothing.  Here's what I got:

 

-I went through the relays.  They all seem to be good.  Switched them out for each other and got the same results all the time.  So I know they are good. 

 

-Checked voltage at the starter.  It is good.  No corrosion on the starter lead, everything is clean and tight.

 

-I have any where from 12.8v to 13.5 depending on how much I've been trying to kick it.

 

-Ground is good and solid.  I even tried making a better ground through some allegator clips, but it didn't help.

 

-Power Commander chip is out of the loop. 

 

My new hypothesis is that maybe the starter is bad?  I might pull it out and bench test it tomorrow.  Any other ideas?

 

thanks.

 

Matt

85218[/snapback]

 

Matt,

You should have close to battery voltage at the big wire on the starter always. When the motor actually cranks it'll drop to about 10 volts. You should also have approximate battery voltage at the little wire on the solenoid when you push your starter button. (I know it's hard to hold in the clutch, push the starter button and have your volt meter connected all at the same time but that is what you need to know) You need !2V at the big wire and it doesn't drop low when the starter button is pushed. and 12V at the little wire when the button is pushed. I'd suspect you are losing voltage at one or the other while attempting to crank the engine due to a poor/loose connection. If you are not losing power and your ground to the starter is good, then you may have a faulty starter. It just would be quite a coincidence.

Tip: Hook your volt meter ground lead directly to the starter mounting bolt when testing for power at the starter wires (if voltage doesn't drop when attempting to have the starter crank you'll know the ground circuit is good as well. ) Hope this helps.

[Guest str8films]

I'll give the hammer trick a try. You think I should be hitting the solenoid or the starter itself?

 

I'll check all the connections again, but they all seem proper, tight, clean and all that. I'll make sure ground is good, too. I'll balance on one foot and pull the clutch, hit the starter, hold the VOM, with connections to the mounting bolts and the starter lead and see if it all works. Might need to stick my tongue out for balance and support. It won't be pretty!

 

Oh and yes, the Battery is good and brand new! Westco from Moto I.

 

-m

[Guest str8films]

Starter is off the bike. Put voltage to it and nothing....finally, I got it to click (starter gear engaged) but not spinning. Whadya think bad, NG, TU stater?

 

I opened up the Valeo starter and saw lots of crud and corrosion in there. Things got wet. Might be a clue...dunno.

 

Can I service the Valeo, rebuild it or do you just get a new one?

 

-m

 

NG = No Good

TU = Tits up