greenmonster
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Posts posted by greenmonster
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My friend is going to make a 1026 cc 4V Duc w a goal of 130 RHP w double injectors, running on ethanol.
The plan is to use MyP8, it`s a 888 so he wants his original engine & ECU to just bolt back on w all wiring untouched.
I will help him and report back here, plan to start it up April.
An help welcome!
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An educated guess is it means End Of Injection, telling us the values are trailing edge of injector pulses as opposed to leading edge which is common too. So the short answer is yes.
Thx, raz.
How about increasing fuel pressure from 3 bar to 4,5 for better timing, together w accurate injection timing?
A waste of energy on our low revving, not so sophisticated engines? High fuel pressure seems to be hip in F1 ECU`s.
Sorry f slight threadjack.
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I have some info on OEM maps.
One parameter/map is Injector EOI Phase Map,
what is that, same as injector timing or what?
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The OEM ecu an WM441 P8 is unapproachable in performance and electronics compared to MyEcuP8 ( the WMP8 is the same ECU mounted on
Lancia Delta Integrale,Sierra Cossworth ),and with the software for eprom tuning i discover this have 18 parameters/maps to set for best performance!!!
Imagine a little: Injection timing,injection advance,partial spark advance,air temperature injection timing/spark advance correction,oil temperature
Injection timing/spark advance correction,pressure injection/spark advance correction,TPS at idle position spark advance correction,RPM depandant
spark advance correction...and many more parameters to set.
Does the WM P8 really have all these features or is it "the software for eprom tuning i discover" that has it?
According to your logs not much numbers/corrections/tuning in most columns.
Or are those parameters avaliable with a gas analyzer and/or your software or what?
And a Q: Should an egine w less stroke than a V11 & HC pistons have more or less injection advance?
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Interesting table, thx f sharing, even if it is not perfect!
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I totally overread this posting. What is the newer TPS the red line shows - is it on a Guzzi? What type of TPS is used with the P8 ecus?
Thanks
Hubert
Newer linear TPS is used on Ducs -03 on, Guzzi I don`t know.
With P8 it`s nonlinear.
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Note that the map says 4500 μs, that is 4.5 ms. I know you knew that if you thought about it, 4500 ms is 4.5 seconds!
Oops...
As I understand it (I may be wrong), while cranking you get 12 ms, period. After engine is running on its own, you'll get the map value plus a 60% start boost that decays over 20 seconds. Plus the usual oil and air temp boosts.From Owners Manual: This table is very important in starting the bike. While the RPM is less than the first column ( 500 RPM ), ie when turning on the starter motor, the Prime table is used to determine the amount of fuel.
And that is 12ms at 20 degrees, is that what you mean, raz?
And Air T & Oil T are only compensations when the engine has started?
What I`m getting at here is when someone has problems w starting, we all understand what parameters in the map that affects just that.
Some more not fully clarified thing w starting:
I also found that mine starts better without any crank boost (all set to 0) and the fast idle only on 1/3rd to 1/2 way, so it may be that my map is still needs work in this area ?--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Really, I always thought that with starting is dealt somewhere else in the map file, not in the InjDur matrix.
I thought SparkAdvance while starting is this:
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# TDCWhileCranking=1 will fire the spark at TDC
# TDCWhileCranking=0 will fire with advance from the map
MyECU Cfg TDCWhileCranking=1
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If so, you should set the spark advance back to 10 or even 12 or 15 degrees in the 500 column. It helps to stabilise idle.
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Welcome, Cliff, good to have you with us!
How much fuel is it getting during cranking for start at 20 degrees C?
Is it like (figures fr standard Cliff Cali map, cold engine):
4500ms (column 1/500 RPM, 2nd TPS) + Air temp boost (+ 3,4% at 20 degrees) + Oil temp choke boost (+18,8% at 20d) + Prime while cranking 12 ms?
5502 ms if so seems quite alot. Or is it normal? Or have I misunderstood something?
# Prime gives the fuel injection time in ms while crankingFrom a MyECU map, what does that mean?
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Think Hubert`s advice is sound, start w basics, no Lambdas etc.
About starting, a cold Ducati 888 4V started w MyP8 & Cliff Cali map totally unmodded!
Something is funny w your settings since it starts easy w WM, all electrics & mechanics in the bike seems OK.
Whatever TPS is set to, MyECU w call that 0, don`t think you need to adjust that.
Just give it a try w step 1, MyP8 in open loop & Cliff`s Cali map.
My 2c.
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Some improvement:
LOG.zip & log.ASCII may contain same info but the files are different.
log.ASCII are readable to me in .text format.
Very interesting!
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We`ll work this out off Forum...
And get back if we get good results.
Gert
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Thx f pics instructions, still no go though...
Strip chart & options under file are shadowed & not avaliable, therefore I think
it is demo versions on http://www.technoresearch.com/Downloads/downloads-VDSTS .
And as you say, your files should probably alter look & extension when VDSTS is properly installed.
Pity, looks relly interesting!
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Sorry, don`t understand "graphical page".
Do you mean like under "file", top left corner, and then "open file"? That function is blocked.
But that seems like what I need.
And, should your log files come as text documents as they are in your zipped file?
Have you bought the VDSTS software?
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Is the VDSTS really freeware? Many options were locked for me when I opened it.
Can it read your log files which seems to be .text files, not .log files?
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Nice idea w LEDs!
I logged the original WM P8 with a cheaper tool hardware+software i bought from Technoresearch if somebody is interested just forcuriosity i send the file of my log,controlled with norton and avira,the program is possible to found here:
http://www.technoresearch.com/Downloads/downloads-VDSTS
The standard version don't need a dongle....
Interesting. How did you connent PC to WM P8?
+1 on luhbo, go nice & easy from start, first things first.
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Compared w the Cali2 map I have from Cliff you are running quite rich, like 20-25% too much overall.
Maybe it simply chokes from too much fuel when you apply thottle?
How does your plugs look?
Breaks looks different, too, here is Cali2:
THR 960 896 832 704 640 576 512 448 384 320 256 192 128 64 0
RPM 500 1000 1322 1520 1750 2011 2314 2663 3061 3521 4045 4658 5357 6157 7088 8152
But I am f sure no Guzzi expert, not even sure that Cali2 is for your model but your profile says Cali.
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Not so hard if I use the formulas you gave me, hope that is OK.
HOW TO CONVERT OEM TPS BREAKS IN DEGREES TO MyECU TPS VALUES:
The older nonlinear TPS is actually just 2way linear like this black graph below (red is the newer, linear type):
We need 2 similar formulas (over/under 30 degrees) + 1 more to convert OEM TPS values in degrees to MyECU TPS values, from now on called MyTPS.
MyTPS 0 is 0 in degrees, max throttle MyTPS 1024 is around 80. In Volt it is 0-5,0V (in reality about 4,75V).
Under 30 degrees:
Formula 1a, degrees TPS to mV:
U = 105,75 x t + 150. U is mV, t is throttle opening in degrees & 150 is base TPS in mV.
Example 10 degrees: 105,75 x 10 = 1057,5 + 150 = 1207,5 mV
Formula 2, convert degrees TPS breaks in mV to MyTPS:
Max TPS mV 5000 / max MV value 1024 = 4,88, a constant which we use to convert all mV into MyTPS.
So, f e 10 degrees to MyTPS: 1207,5 / 4,88 = 247 MyTPS.
Over 30 degrees:
Formula 1b, degrees TPS to mV:
U = (t-30) x 28,0835 + 3332
Example 45 degrees: (45-30) = 15 x 28,0835 = 421 + 3332 = 3753 mV
Then use formula 2/constant: 3753 mV / 4,88 = 769 MyTPS.
The RPM breaks in MyECU are the same kind as OEM maps.
The basic formula (1a) is confirmed here as well:
http://www.bikeboy.org/ducati4vthrottleb.html
The relationship between degrees and voltage under 30 degrees throttle opening is: mV = (degrees x 105) + 150Many thx f the help, raz, hope I got it right!
EDIT: Edited & updated 01-01-09.
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Would not recommend anyone who isn´t skilled in electronics (like me...) to buy it as a kit.
Mine had to take a trip to Au, my friend managed to sort it out. Cliff has changed PCB manufacturer recently (mine had a hairline crack).
Maybe we should write a scetch for a FAQ w how to work easiest, calculate TPS values, avoid handling errors etc?
That is, all that the manuals on the site miss? And on a more user friendly, lower tech level?
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MyECU tested on Ducati 888 (P8), works.
Software quirks I`ve noticed:
ECUcontrol: If I download map from bike and leave bike power on, I can`t alter values.
In Global Map Adjust window, adjusting broader areas: +1 percent fuel or degree ignition results in +2 increase, decrease same.
Otherwise works fine f me, Dyno`d w good results.
EDIT:
ECUcontrol:In Global Map Adjust window, adjusting broader areas: +1 percent fuel or degree ignition results in +2 increase, decrease same.
Answer fr Cliff: Only press Apply or OK, otherwise command is doubled.
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Just FYI:
MyECU tested on 907IE, Cagiva 900ie & ST4engine Ducatis.
Works good. Some work w translating Guzzi maps to Ducs. Test w P8/888 soon.
Greenmonster
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Yes, but I still miss the injector dead time figures.
That`s a task f the ECU.
I gave nominal flow rate figures f injectors.
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I've tried googling for nominal figures for my IW031 injectors (V11 seems to have the same) but haven't found any yet.
Green injector, 280.4.002.1A/IW-031: 270cc/minute.
Yellow IW-025: 268
Red IW-042: 190
The MyECU thread
in How to...
Posted
You`re welcome but you`ll have to bring the Urquells to outside Alingsås between showers!
Time to get back to original thread:
So, injection timing, seems it´s best to open at closed valves for best evaporisation.
600 best f load and around 300 f idle/low load-revs? Should we add another value for part load/cruising around 4k RPM/10-20% TPS?
Easiest text software to use, Excel or something else?