Greg Field Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 This is the first time in recorded history that Dave and Ratch have agreed on anything. I would submit that a rational look at the chance that they could both agree and both be right is infinitesimally small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Hold on David, hold on. Just for a moment. Have you ever looked at the picture that Greg has posted several times now? Have you ever seen it? Not the light, the picture Think about that, for a short moment only, do me the favour, and then you may catch up again to this furious stampede. Hubert Which picture? the square wheels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 This is the first time in recorded history that Dave and Ratch have agreed on anything. I would submit that a rational look at the chance that they could both agree and both be right is infinitesimally small. I don't fully agree with him. I think the true truth lies somewhere between G2G's and RH's truths. The thermal paste's mojo will never perfectly balance that of the cooling finned heat sink. But the concept of getting the sensor probe tip conductance to engine heat, while balancing the over heating, by keeping the sensor body at a consistent ambient temperature makes sense. My doubt is because of the inconsistency of the sensor body's temperature over various air speeds, especially when a heat sink is attached. A wind shield could mitigate the issue. You mentioned duct tape.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ratchethack Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Frankly, I don't much care who believes what, but it seems that there's been so much of the usual confusion, animosity, and outright mendacity in the face of out-of-the-ordinary ideas here, that somebody had best step up to help sort this out. I note that NONE of those who've "disagreed" with what I've actually done and successfully tested on the road as posted possess any basis for, nor position from which to disagree wotsoever -- neither from personal experience, nor by credible reference to any other knowledge base established upon running either a heat sink or a resistor with a V11 sensor/holder. One has actually proudly proclaimed he hasn't read my posts before posting many times with wildly unfounded (and false) accusations about their content that he can't back up with any evidence wotsoever. For all of those with the above NULL CASE upon which to present an argument, please ask yourself a simple multiple-choice question: Q: Why would I do something that doesn't work, and then take the time to document it here? There are only 3 options: A. I've gone fully round the bend. I've deluded myself into believing false principles of my own imagination that have no basis in reality. To support my neurosis, I ride a Guzzi that now runs worse on the road than it did before addition of the thermo-paste, heat sink and variable resistor, and I choose to continue to endure this self-inflicted punishment out of some psychotically deluded urge to maintain some semblance of cognitive consonance. B. I'm intentionally lying. I've Photoshopped and fabricated a Great Walloping Farce for my own twisted amusement, just because I enjoy flushing out those on the Forum who habitually and irrationally lash out in full defense mode at new and somewhat unorthodox, yet fully road-validated concepts, and who tend to mindlessly castigate that which is beyond their experience and/or comprehension. I'm actually happily riding a Guzzi without either thermo-paste, heat sink, or resistor, and I've been laughing hysterically at this ridiculous Clusterfarge as it's unfolded. C. It works as presented. The addition of thermo-paste, heat sink and variable resistor in fact, delivers both a significantly more enjoyable riding experience, and better mileage to boot with the particular "library" PC III map I'm running. Please note there's no possible blend of choices between A, B, and C. Only one choice is possible. NOTE: Again, I couldn't possibly care less about who would choose what, consensus opinion, or how the numbers break down (as if this would carry any significance a-tall?) or I reckon I'd have started a poll. For any of those habitually conditioned to indulge in the fallacy of GROUPTHINK, who're thus incapable of thinking for yourselves, if you're compelled to start your own and discover which way Forum consensus goes on this as the default determination upon which you hang your beliefs, by all means, knock yourself out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guzzi2Go Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 "A" gets my vote! Reading a few posts back, I saw that we started with air gap, 500k pot, plastic washer and a heatsink, but without thermo-goo and considerations to change the map. Give it some 20 pages more and we will settle for no air gap, no pot, no washer, no heatsink, but thermo-goo + richer map. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luhbo Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Which picture? the square wheels? Yes, that's what I thought. Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Field Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Only 11 more pages to go and we'll hit the magic 40 . . . Anyone who thinks for himself will see that three options is only a partial selection among the possibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Only 11 more pages to go and we'll hit the magic 40 . . . Anyone who thinks for himself will see that three options is only a partial selection among the possibilities. The Dao Jones is now up to 7223. Should we revise the magic number? Maybe the Dow Jones will hit 10,000 if we make 100 pages? Headline reads: Variable Resistor Sales Rally Dow Jones Ratchethack Industries credited for major breakthrough in thermo-inertia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Hold on David, hold on. Just for a moment. Have you ever looked at the picture that Greg has posted several times now? Have you ever seen it? Not the light, the picture Think about that, for a short moment only, do me the favour, and then you may catch up again to this furious stampede. Hubert I still don't get it. Care to elaborate? I did find a cross post by Greg that pointed to Guzziology 7-56/57, and I found the claim that the Quota 1100es runs best with the brass adapter and they backed it up with a CO measurement 0.5% higher (richer) My experience and Ratchet's has been the opposite, that the brass adapter makes it run as if it were running too lean. I'd guess that when I am blasting down the freeway, the cooling fins will make it run richer, but when the wind speed drops the brass adapter conducts the heat more than the plastic, so the sensor body alone does not dump the heat fast enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luhbo Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Well, I thought the pic showing the brass holder with broken isolation and the aftermarket brass holder without isolation and added cooling fins made everything clear. But I'm not sure whether this is really the intention of this thread. Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Field Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 We're starting to get some good humor in this thread. I guess there always was, but now it's intentional. I'd be happy if the Dow starts an upward rise fueled by Ratchet Industries. I'm pretty sure the tally is not going to last, sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Well, I thought the pic showing the brass holder with broken isolation and the aftermarket brass holder without isolation and added cooling fins made everything clear. But I'm not sure whether this is really the intention of this thread. Hubert The brass is both cooling and conducting more that the plastic. In some situations it will cool more and one will see a richer running bike. In other situation it will heat more and one will see a leaner running bike. I'll bet I am seeing both, but the lean condition is the more annoying. The important questions are: When does the brass adapter make it run too cool and when does it run too rich? Does the brass result in a less accurate transmitter of heat reading? When at high speeds and in the rain, it runs cooler than with the plastic adapter. When in low wind conditions it runs hotter than with the plastic adapter. IMHO the plastic is more accurate, because it is more consistent over varying conditions. Subject to me changing my mind, I think the ideal setup would be a sensor that would not go out of the range of 5% accuracy, nor would the ohm value change to a reading above 125C during any riding that we might encounter, and the sensor would have a longer probe making more direct contact, but with a better insulator between point of probe contact and sensor body, and last but not least a map that better reacted to the reading. (regardless, I think a couple of resistors and switches to mildly enrichen and or enlean the machine on demand are a fine idea) Finding or fabricating such a setup is not likely to happen, so Ratchet's solution starts to make more sense as it addresses both the running too cold by adding goop and the running too hot, by adding cooling fins, but it appears to be both pushing and pulling in various directions, sometimes at the wrong time. How often it is the wrong time is subject to endless speculation. Some to think the set up wrong is too much of the time and Ratchet apparently thinks it is never more wrong than if he had left it alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luhbo Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 Maybe it's time for intermission in this great opera, right somewhere between the first and second 20 pages So get your glass of champagne and devote yourself to this: B.O.F.H. It'll bring you into the right mood for the second half Aren't you in the same business? Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 15, 2009 Share Posted March 15, 2009 Maybe it's time for intermission in this great opera, right somewhere between the first and second 20 pages So get your glass of champagne and devote yourself to this: B.O.F.H. It'll bring you into the right mood for the second half Aren't you in the same business? Hubert That explains the motive of some of your posts BOFH is funny stuff, but reading it is too painful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Act II scene 1 The Bass-baritone, Don-Davido Lainguini gets off his ass, goes to the garage, removes the sensor and brass adapter, takes out the cold solder that he had coiled under the probe tip, like a spring, wraps slightly more teflon tape around threads of sensor and reinstalls, sans solder. He then goes for a 70+ mile ride, and not notices not one single POP! But please note, the weather was cool today, but should be warming to near 80 later this week....stay tuned, for reports of falling MPG but quite likely a happier ride. Still there is plenty of room to lean up the cold zones in the map using Tuneboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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