87 OCTANE

[Guest BIGGERJIM]

HEY YALL

 

WILL THIS BIKE PING ON 87 OCTANE GAS

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

THANKS

BIGGERJIM

[ponti_33609]

Hi - I am new to Guzzi's but I was told on another board that I risk burning valves if I run the cheap stuff. Again, not an expert, just passing along the info.

 

Regards,

Bob

[Dan M]

Hi - I am new to Guzzi's but I was told on another board that I risk burning valves if I run the cheap stuff. Again, not an expert, just passing along the info.

 

Regards,

Bob

 

More like putting holes in your pistons if spark knock is heavy.

[dlaing]

HEY YALL

 

WILL THIS BIKE PING ON 87 OCTANE GAS

 

 

THANKS

BIGGERJIM

I tried it, and yes it does ping, but only at very heavy throttle, probably up to about 6000rpms. So if all the gas station has is 87 octane, you can certainly(edit maybe I am too optimistic??? All bike vary in their state of tune) make it home, just go easy on the throttle and if you need power keep the revs up.

[Dan M]

I know for a fact that there are Guzzi riders with more miles than everyone on this thread combined who only use 87 octane gas. They don't burn valves. They don't hole pistons. They ride/rode EV models, Cal III, Eldo, Ambo. These models do have lower compression/output than the V11s.

 

Burnt valves has more to do with improper/no valve clearance than fuel octane.

 

I've run 86-87, maybe even 85 in my bike, if that's all that was available when I needed gas at some one horse town. I usually run premium b/c I think it runs better.

 

I've not heard of anyone holing a Guzzi piston, as they are sturdy and forged. I have seized them to varying degrees before on 850 Le Mans IIIs.

 

We are talking about the V11 right? Ping has to be heavy and prolonged to melt a hole in a piston. High compression, high load, high heat, lean mixture and low octane are a recipe for trouble. I've put cheap gas in my LeMans when it was all I could get and it didn't ping but others have reported ping from these bikes. Certainly you can run low octane and get away with it under the right conditions, but I wouldn't make a blanket statement and say you can't hurt them.

[Ryland3210]

I tried it, and yes it does ping, but only at very heavy throttle, probably up to about 6000rpms. So if all the gas station has is 87 octane, you can certainly(edit maybe I am too optimistic??? All bike vary in their state of tune) make it home, just go easy on the throttle and if you need power keep the revs up.

 

I run 87 octane unless it's hot outside and I expect to be bombing along at 70-90 on an interstate highway. Strangely, it did not ping at low RPM, where I would normally expect it to under heavy load. That's how I tested it the first time I used 87 octane. I thought I was safe, until I noticed some pinging at 4000-6000 RPM.

[guzzi1]

I run 87 octane unless it's hot outside and I expect to be bombing along at 70-90 on an interstate highway. Strangely, it did not ping at low RPM, where I would normally expect it to under heavy load. That's how I tested it the first time I used 87 octane. I thought I was safe, until I noticed some pinging at 4000-6000 RPM.

i've never posted here so no avatar.anyway my 03 lemans pings at 3-4500 when low on fuel and the temp is in the high 80's.valve clearance is good,no air leaks i can find and the bike is bone stock with 10k on the odo.this is audible on the freeway when i roll the throttle on in 5th and 6th gear and i've always run 91 octane.ran a tank of 100 unleaded VP that i run in my 450 dirtbike once with no real gain.so what gives?is this common?bike runs fine at idle and everywhere else and really good on cool days with a fresh tank o'shell high test.any ideas?

[DeBenGuzzi]

thats it, I'm going with primo, well would midgrade be ok? I usually run midgrade as I've read a few places that all primo does is waste gas but yet I don't like running the lowend, I just go midgrade most of the time with the cheap stuff or not in hot weather I get some pinging but really I think I have some minor detonation in rush hour as it pops and stutters a little bit if I sit in a 90deg day bumper to bumper too long

[Greg Field]

If I really baby it, my V11 can be limped along on regular. I live in a hilly town, though. It's tough to get by on regular. It pings on premium sometimes.

[Ryland3210]

i've never posted here so no avatar.anyway my 03 lemans pings at 3-4500 when low on fuel and the temp is in the high 80's.valve clearance is good,no air leaks i can find and the bike is bone stock with 10k on the odo.this is audible on the freeway when i roll the throttle on in 5th and 6th gear and i've always run 91 octane.ran a tank of 100 unleaded VP that i run in my 450 dirtbike once with no real gain.so what gives?is this common?bike runs fine at idle and everywhere else and really good on cool days with a fresh tank o'shell high test.any ideas?

 

The low tank level may be allowing the fuel to get hotter, and the space over the engine and intake air box as well, but that's a second order effect. High 80's temperature is the bigger factor on an air cooled engine. I suggest calibrating the TPS and synching the throttle bodies. The TPS signal is used by the ECU to set ignition timing. Another possibility is the heat range on the spark plugs. If they are running hot, that can assist pre-ignition.

[guzzi1]

The low tank level may be allowing the fuel to get hotter, and the space over the engine and intake air box as well, but that's a second order effect. High 80's temperature is the bigger factor on an air cooled engine. I suggest calibrating the TPS and synching the throttle bodies. The TPS signal is used by the ECU to set ignition timing. Another possibility is the heat range on the spark plugs. If they are running hot, that can assist pre-ignition.

i agree with your noting of the fuel temp when tank is low.she'll take 4 gallons when the light comes on so that's the level that the problem is the worst.closed loop injection allows excess fuel to be returned to the tank and i believe this increases the heat as well.plugs are by the manual which i have.3 languages and none are american.har har.as for dealers we had one in sacto ca 4 miles from my house but the @#$$#! dropped the brand in 05.curse ye of little faith!anyway if i drive 75 miles to the bay area and get the diagnostic done there.the tps and throttle bodies have never been touched so perhaps it would be a good idea.my wifes yamaha 05 fz6 was recalled for the tps which the dealer changed out and the difference in how that bike performed was incredible.does anyone name there guzzi on this site?

[Ryland3210]

i agree with your noting of the fuel temp when tank is low.she'll take 4 gallons when the light comes on so that's the level that the problem is the worst.closed loop injection allows excess fuel to be returned to the tank and i believe this increases the heat as well.plugs are by the manual which i have.3 languages and none are american.har har.as for dealers we had one in sacto ca 4 miles from my house but the @#$$#! dropped the brand in 05.curse ye of little faith!anyway if i drive 75 miles to the bay area and get the diagnostic done there.the tps and throttle bodies have never been touched so perhaps it would be a good idea.my wifes yamaha 05 fz6 was recalled for the tps which the dealer changed out and the difference in how that bike performed was incredible.does anyone name there guzzi on this site?

 

According to my '04 manual, the plugs are NGK BPR 6 ES You should be able to cross that over to a Champion or other brand, and find the hotter and colder options while you are at it.

 

Among my pals, cars have been named Green Machine (my '67 Barracuda), Black Bastard (bad reliability), Wrinkle (numerous unrepaired fender benders, mostly drunk driving), Firepig (I always beat him drag racing with my Barracuda). I haven't owne my bike long enough for it to develop a personality, but thanks for the idea.

[Anthony]

HEY YALL

 

WILL THIS BIKE PING ON 87 OCTANE GAS

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

THANKS

BIGGERJIM

 

Yes. I made the mistake. I use 87 in the cars and wasn't paying attention to what I was doing.

 

Go 92 or better.

[Guzzi2Go]

...The owner's manual/factory recommendation is to run 93 or 95 octane. We can't even get that here. I'm lucky to get 91...

Kevin, aren't you using MON instead of RON over there? Wouldn't that explain the difference in octane rating between Italian users manual and US petrol stations? Lowest grade petrol that can be found in EU is 91 RON (being phased out), going over 95, 98 and the highest 100. As I can recall from my trip to US some five years ago, these numbers were in the "80-ies MON range".

 

I use 95 RON and I think I hear slight pinging when accellerating hard from low RPM. However, maybe I am mistaking it for some other noise (plenty of that on a MG).

 

Then again, maybe I should just pay a few cents extra.

 

P.S.

 

Look what I just found: http://www.btinternet.com/~madmole/Reference/RONMONPON.html

Apparently, there is also a PON (Pump Octane Number)

[Ryland3210]

I think that our US pump #'s are RON. That's an average octane rating, if I'm not mistaken. I don't remember what units the owner's manual recommendation specifies. It's no matter, because I typically use Premium (91-93), which is the highest we can get, besides racing fuel. It doesn't surprise me that European fuel is better. Over here, it's quantity versus quality (all you can eat buffet, 4 for $1, etc.).

 

My recollection is that the pump octane here is the average of the RON (Research Octane Number) and a test Octane number. The RON is the highest of the rating methods. Therefore the octane listed on the pumps here is lower than the RON. Some of the pumps used to indicate the rating method, but it's been years since I checked. I'll start checking again.