al_roethlisberger Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 Here's an interesting observation while reading the "factory service manual" for the V11 Sport last night... ...in the fuel-injection section, they illustrate where the fuel-filter and pump are located. In the Service Manual, they show the PUMP up on TOP of the spine under the tank, and the FILTER down UNDER the frame... which is completely opposite of how I've seen most late-model V11 Sport/LeMans. And is of course is how my 2002 LeMans is, with the pump UNDER the frame. This is interesting, as I had just been entertaining switching the location of the pump and filter to keep the pump and low-pressure side of the system cool. I wonder why it flip-flopped.... did the factory guys just get confused? ...or was it a conscious design change? I've also heard that some interim 2002-2003 models had their pump moved out in front of the engine/frame perpendicular to the frame, located above the oil-cooler like on some older models. al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichMaund Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 I noticed that too. Mine is under the spine vice above. They probably did it to provide more net positive suction head (NPSH) to the pump allowing it to self prime more easily and prevent vapor binding/cavitation at the suction end. Seems to have worked on mine as it has no issues with vapor lock like some bikes do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 24, 2003 Author Share Posted May 24, 2003 ..ahh, that makes sense, as the fuel would have to travel "up" via gravity/head-pressure to reach the pump, which may offset any benefits of putting it on top. Bottom line, I think MG didn't think this little area through very well ...and now in 2003 we have the real solution. Makes me still wonder what(how much $$) it would take to get a 2003 tank/pump and have it painted. It's not a priority for me, but it would be nice to have. Anything that reduces the chance of over-heating and cleans up the area under the tank it a big plus to me. al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Stewart Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 Al, Besides the fuel tank and pump, you better add in the special lines and fittings that go along with the in the tank pump setup. It also looks like the pump and return are on the right side of the tank! The bad news is... how do you use the fuel on the left side of the tank? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 24, 2003 Author Share Posted May 24, 2003 ..oh sure, I assumed all new fittings and lines. Although I'd probably go buy some aircraft certified fire/heat resistant lines, etc... and use instead. Just because they are cool The bad news is... how do you use the fuel on the left side of the tank? Good question... although a guess: Maybe the pump is on the left side?? Can you see where the pump is by looking into the tank? As it is now on pre-2003 bikes, we can't get to the right side fuel anyway ...we just have to shake-and-wiggle to get it slosh over to petcock! al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Stewart Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 ...we just have to shake-and-wiggle to get it slosh over to petcock! Or did you mean to your GOLD MEMBER! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 24, 2003 Author Share Posted May 24, 2003 ...yes, anything more than "two shakes" is entertainment At least that's what I hear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callison Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 If you've ever changed the fuel filter, you'll really appreciate that is on top of the spine. On my Sport 1100i it's under the spine and takes about and hour. On my California it's between frame members and it takes about three hours to change it. On my V11 Sport, it will probably take about 15 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 Just changed mine yesterday with only minimal skin loss. Nearly finished except a hose clamp broke. Rather than contemplating a new tank, wouldn't it be simpler to get some fuel line and brackets and move things around. It will make for easier servicing in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 25, 2003 Author Share Posted May 25, 2003 ...indeed, and I've thought about that as well. I may have a look around once I take the tank off again in the coming weeks. However, off-hand, I don't have a good idea of where one could move the pump that would be better. Who knows though <_> al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted May 25, 2003 Share Posted May 25, 2003 "15 minutes!?!" I spent 6 hours today, failing to install a fuel filter! Here is a How To on how NOT to change the filter. 1PM grabbed NAPA 3008 that I had bought months ago, and air filter kit from FBF. Tank off tank, thank the gods I wear glasses, as the fuel splashes in my face. 1:30PM wash face. 1:45PM Air Filter installs in five minutes. 1:50PM determine that I will need some sort of fitting to mate the NAPA 3008 to the hoses. Also notice that filter appears to have failed, as evidenced by grey fuel on "clean" side of filter. (Moral: Do not run filter for 18000 miles) 2PM Go shopping and recycle 5 gallons of oil. 3PM Kragen has no fittings but I can browse all the possible Fram filters. The Pathfinder filter might work but it is alot smaller 3:45PM Car Quest is very helpful. They don't have the fittings, but they hook me up with a filter that is close to the original. However the fittings are a little bigger.(Do NOT try if fittings are wrong size!) I also pick up a couple feet of 5/16"(8mm) FI hose. 4:15PM Fish Tacos at Rosa's, YUM! 4:45PM Visit Auto Zone just to make sure they don't have the fittings for the NAPA 3008 They do not appear to and the counter help is toooo busy. 5:15PM pick up the mail for mother. 5:30PM Install the filter from Carquest with stock hose leading under air filter and replace hose going between filter and pump. (oh yah, my pump is low and my filter is high, perhaps that is why I have never had vapor lock) 6:00PM I t is all back together and I fire up the engine, the new air filter sounds great! And then sputter, swhosh, cut engine, and stand back and hope that it does not catch fire as the steam of fuel rises. 7PM Take air entire air filter assembly off so that I will be able to replace all of the hose, and pack it up for the night. Time to search the web for the appropriate filter....may go with pathfinder filter or Napa Gold FIL3023. Got to remove 3008 from my website.... Would like to source out higher quality hose and fittings. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest geezerx Posted May 25, 2003 Share Posted May 25, 2003 Please add one more vote to the "between the jugs" tally. For some reason my crAPPLE can't. I previewed the poll results prior to voting and now the poll thinks that I already voted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichMaund Posted May 25, 2003 Share Posted May 25, 2003 If you plan to move the pump, put it as low as possible and away from heat sources. On my Cali 1100 it was low on the left side of the frame aft of the tranny. Bitch to get to, but a good location from a NPSH and cooling standpoint. No worries with it in 23k miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 25, 2003 Author Share Posted May 25, 2003 (oh yah, my pump is low and my filter is high, perhaps that is why I have never had vapor lock) ...actually, this is the "vapor lock prone" arrangement which exposes the pump to the most heat, and is what most later V11 Sports/LeMans seem to have. As does mine al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted May 25, 2003 Share Posted May 25, 2003 ...actually, this is the "vapor lock prone" arrangement which exposes the pump to the most heat, and is what most later V11 Sports/LeMans seem to have. As does mine al Yah, I guess that is why the V1100sporti owners don't complain about vapor lock, just other stuff. I am suprised that if the pump is on top that the fuel pump can self prime if the tank is low on fuel. It looks like what needs shielding the most is the line from the tank to the pump. I think mine rests against the left cylinder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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