al_roethlisberger
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Posts posted by al_roethlisberger
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....well, yes "test-benches don't lie" ... but keep in mind that your "butt" is probably the best gauge of performance there is, from your point of view.
So if the Centauro with the Mistral "felt" faster in real-world riding to you, then that's all that really mattered.
And it's also keen to remember that torque is really what we "feel" when we ride, not HP. So if there was a small bump in torque or even HP in the low/midrange where we all mostly ride, then that probably represented the most bang-for-your-buck than high-RPM power. You probably would never notice the 10hp at the very top-end in normal day-to-day riding, unless you were racing where there were some long straight-aways.
Anyway, that's just been my observation. So I wouldn't be too disheartened by the dyno results, especially if your "butt dyno" told you that the bike was faster and more responsive. It probably was, and your impression of your bike is all that matters after all.
BTW, I was pretty disappointed in those performance numbers that were posted in the CW Scura test... I wonder why they were so low? I expect close to 80HP at the rear-wheel, even stock. The torque figures seems about 10ft/lbs low too. ...who knows.
I'm hoping that with some quality aftermarket pipes, good tuning, and maybe some head port tuning/flow-benching later this year, I can get closer to 90+ HP at the rear-wheel. Who knows though...
al
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OK, sneaky "Scura Owner".... you managed to slip by the gas-mileage poll and remain anonymous... now I'm thinking I won't answer your questions until you register!
...ah well, I don't have the heart *laugh*
Well, I went and measured the pin on my seat. The pin is ~23mm long. This is the exposed part of the pin past it's plate, not including the length all the way through the plate. Does that make sense? Anyway, these measurements are from the top edge of the plate.
See I'm being global and using the metric system
In order... the first edge of the notch is 3mm up from the plate, the second edge is ~10mm, and the tip of the pin is ~23mm.... or "down" if you are looking at the seat on the bike.
Now, I didn't measure any of this from the seat-pan itself, because as I mentioned, the pan is hand-laid resin. So each seat is going to vary by quite a bit. The bracket/plate on my seat was mounted with one ~1.5mm rubber washer between the braket/plate and the seat-pan.
My stock latch has one ~.5mm silver washer under the latch. But that's it.
With all of this in mind, my seat fits great. I have to gently push down to squish the rubber bumpers under the seat, but it latches firmly and "jumps up" when I unlock it. A very nice fit.
My thoughts are still that your pin may be a bit too low on the seat-pan, and would ask Corbin if they could adjust it appropriately. Or you could do what you have done and raise the latching mechanism just a bit. Either method should have the same effect. But I'm sure Corbin would make it right if you inquired.
Ed - Short answer, yes you lose the ability to use the seat cowling, as that bolts to the stock seat, and the shape of the Corbin doesn't allow room for a cowl.
Long answer... since the Corbin seat is more-or-less a "fastback" design, this already mimics the visual effect of the cowling, PLUS you can now have a passenger without needing to remove anything. From a distance, you wouldn't know the difference, except that the new seat isn't "shiny".
...and that's always been the catch-22 with seat-cowlings in my opinion. They may look nifty, but when you get an opportunity to carry a passenger or cargo, where do you put the thing when you have to remove it??
Anyway, it's certainly a matter of personal taste, but I like the seat better than the bolt-on cowling. It looked like an afterthought, especially since it was another color, and the Corbin seat solution looks more integrated. Well, that's my opinion anyway
Currently, my seat-cowling is bolted to my stock seat... safely packed away and gathering dust.
al
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... I wonder if that will fit in a V11 Spine Frame?
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...yep, sorry to say that the stock cans do change color with time to a purplish hue. But I knew that before I bought the bike, and my dealer "warned" me about it as well.
It's just a function of the heat, sunlight, and anodized black finish. I think that because it is brushed/satin, the combination of increased surface area, and off-angle reflection from the sunlight tend to mute the black, and accenuate the faded color.... that's my theory anyway
BTW Jaap, did the installation of your aftermarket pipe "de-accentuate" the very obvious uneven placement of the stock exhausts when viewed from the rear? If you look at a stock 2002, you will note that the right muffler is a good inch or so further out from the bike to clear the bevel-box, with the passenger peg mount angled out a few degrees further than the left one, and the bracket on the right muffler also modified to kick it out a bit.
I was thinking that with the aftermarket cans probably having the same brackets for each side, that this would become less pronounced.
....or is my bike the only one with uneven exhausts?!
Check out my pics of the fender eliminator from the back to see what I am talking about. Having the fender removed accentuates the effect:
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/bc/al_roethlisb...nder+Eliminator
al
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Actually there are indeed a couple different schools of thought on engine break-in, and most of the engine builders subscribe to the more aggessive of the two and focus on "heat cycles".
Generally manufacturers have two issues that drive the much more conservative prescriptions as found in the owner's manual:
- The tolerances of their mass-produced engine components are not terribly "close" in each engine, as opposed to a purpose-built engine. So the break-in may take longer, otherwise exposing the engine components to "hot spots" during operation.
- Manufacterers tend to be much more conservative than necessary to try to avoid warrantee issues. Sometimes this sacrifices the ultimate performance of the engine, but protects them from premature failures of an overaggressive break-in routine.
Some links:
http://www.angelfire.com/ia/z/FZ1breakin.htm (almost bought an FZ1)
http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
http://www.seansa4page.com/resource/breakin.html
...and of course, there are more... just do a google search.
Anyway, I'm somewhere in the middle. If you read between the lines, most of these folks recommend not revving beyond the prescribed RPM for an "extended period of time" while occassionally revving higher. That's where I tend to apply my break-in.
Right now I have 700 miles on the bike, and I generally keep it between 3-5k RPM, and every so often zip up a little past 6k, but only for a moment. I may have touched 7k once or twice because I wasn't paying attention, but I don't think that will matter. I'll have the bike in for it's first scheduled service(versus the gasket blowout the other week) in a week or so, then I can ride a little faster.
Of course, "your mileage may vary" ... so choose whatever method you feel most comfortable with. Hopefully these links just offered a little more info for you to consider and digest
al
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...just as an FYI, my tach stopped fogging after about 200 miles new. I can only assume it picked up some moisture during shipping from one climate to another, but it cleared up in a few days. And mine did it "in the heat too", so it was odd.
But if it starts again, I'll do the "drill modification"... although, now that I think about it, I'm getting a new tach under warrantee anyway due to a blemish on the bezel... so we'll see how the new one behaves *sigh*
But on the Q/A front, I whole-heartedly agree that the bikes are great, except MG needs to really get a handle on the details and durability. It seems that issues with the engine and transmission would have been worked out years ago given the nature of the design. And issues with paint and finish should be no-brainers if you get the right folks to do the work.
The bikes are really great, and I am just hoping that Aprilia will inject some higher quality into the bikes, and that they'll get their act together regarding parts & accessories availability.
... hoping and waiting...
al
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BTW, I'm glad I wasn't the only one having trouble doing that whacky L/100KM to MPG conversion!
For a minute there, I thought I was losing my mind when the math wasn't working. An odd conversion for sure!
THANK YOU!
al
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Hey there Scura owner =)
Well, I'll try to answer your questions in order...
I would also direct you to my review in the "old forum" section, where I detailed my experience with Corbin, and the seat.
Regarding your first question about fit: Since the pans of the Corbin seats are more-or-less hand-laid resin on a form, I can only assume that the final fit of each seat will be a little different. If they took too much or not enough off of the resin to attach the pin, I can certainly see where you may have a hard time fitting it properly. In my case, the seat needs a slight push down on the tail and it latches, and it is a tighter fit to get it latched than the stocker, however it has gotten easier over the last few weeks... so something is stretching a little, which I can only assume is the seat-pan, as there is nothing else that could really "give". All in all it fits very well on my bike, and I like that the fit of the latch is more "positive" than stock. However I too would have been disappointed if I had required actual modification of the stock latch to make it fit.
My gap along the bottom of the seat is also slightly greater than stock, but is also very uniform and looks fine. The rest of the fit, at least on my bike, it spot-on with the stock unit.
So bottom line, each seat will probably fit each bike a little bit differently, but it should *fit*. If you have to do anything too dramatic, I am certain that Corbin would make it right for you.
Regarding the design of the seat: When I first sat on the unfinished "stock" Corbin V11 seat, the back of the seat "dish" was indeed waaaay too far back for me as well. I had them add almost 3 inches of foam to the back, then shape it accordingly. They also sanded/sculpted/removed/dished out about 1/2 inch in the seat so that I would have more of a horn/rise at the front of the seat. This worked out well for me in regard to comfort, fit, and height, as my inseam is only 30 inches
If you ordered yours from the catalog or online, you would have received their "custom" seat for the V11, but it would have been their "stock" design that is designed for the masses, so it is likely that some aspects may not have fit your physique exactly. I know it didn't mine.
The moral of the story here is, if you can get to one of the two Corbin factory showrooms here in Hollister, CA or Daytona, FL(USA)... and have your seat custom tailored(for no extra cost, and a free lunch to boot!!) I can't recommend it enough.
But if you have to order it, and I personally haven't tried that method, I would recommend trying to describe your physique and them over the phone. Worst case, you could order the seat, try it out, make notes, then send it back for tailoring. My experience with Corbin is that they will "make it right".
But all in all, I can't be happier with my seat
It fits me well, and looks really great on the bike.I'd say give Corbin a call and see if they can make some alterations based on your observations. I bet after you have that done, you'll be much more impressed. They can also lower the pin a few mm so that you don't have to modify your lock mechanism.
Hope that helps!
al
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My goodness, yep, it looks like that works out to be about USD$620 for the kit! And I don't even know if that includes paint for the new tail-piece. Somehow I doubt it
I think it would be even better if included a provision for eliminating the big mud-flap as well. Otherwise, there's still "a lot going on" around the tail and with those nice lights, it would be nice to simplify that whole fender, indicator light, and license section.
...but very nice indeed
al
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Yep, a very attractive solution to be sure, but I believe that a significant amount of work/modification would have to be done to get the system that is on the G&B to fit our regular V11 Sport/Lemans/Scura bikes.
If you look at the photo:
... a much different tail-section would be required to accomodate the silencers, and the relocation of lighting, electronics, battery, etc... although it could certainly be done, a-la Wolf and other aftermarket manufacturers.
But in fact, it appears that on the other two newer models from G&B that they have a system more akin to Buell's under body exhaust, and are abandoning the undertail solution:
I can only assume this is for performance, but who knows. Perhaps there are issues with placement and heat for the underseat solution??
However, a suggestion: Instead of contacting G&B, since it is obviously a custom/specific system for their bikes... it might make more sense to inquire with a manufacturer such as Wolf, BOS, or the like and see if they are considering a system. If there were enough interest from owners, they may consider developing one. But their systems are pretty pricey, and it's debateable whether you get more "looks" than performance increase. And any low-volume bike like a V11 Guzzi would make the system even pricier. I guess it just depends on your priority.
But IMHO, I really like the styling/function of the side-by-side system that is current to the V11 Sport/LeMans/Scura. However, future models may be very interesting with underseat solutions. So keep pinging Guzzi, and you never know what may show up
Now if I can just get someone with some decent photos of the Staintunes, and some opinions on them versus the Leo Vince's... and I'll be set!
al
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...ah, so this poll will serve a "dual purpose" then
But honestly, to me the bigger question is still total range... till dry. After all, that's what will keep me worried on a long ride
We should have a poll on that later as well.al
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Thanks Janus!
It sounds like these will be perfect then. Now if I can just get someone to actually sell me some!
al
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As an alternative, here are some photos of the Leo Vince Carbon exhausts, although I'd probably go with Titanium to try to get a good color/finish match with the bike:
I really like the Leo Vince products, as several of my friends have had these exhausts. But then again, the fit/finish and permanent baffle system on the Staintunes is very attractive as well.
This is the only photo I've seen of the Staintunes on a V11:
Again, if anyone has any good photos of the Staintunes on a V11 Sport/LeMans from various angles, especially the whole bike, that would be very helpful. Also if anyone has any comparitive knowledge on fit, finish, performance, specifications(weight, etc).... between the two, that would be much appreciated.
...until then, I'm in limbo
al
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I don't have any details on this modification, but it seems very interesting:
http://www.scharfenort-frank.de/Umbauten%2...V11%20Sport.htm
It looks like a quality job.
al
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Thanks! That site had some of the best photos and information on the bags that I have seen yet....
So, a couple questions for those already with the bags in-hand:
1) Do the V11 Tekno bags have the "fast click" system as illustrated on the website? If so, how well does it seem to work? If not, how do the bags attach, and how secure is it? ...can you lock them?
2) Also, by looking at the frame and "fast click" system in the photos, how well does the system keep the bags from sliding forward or backwards on the frame when loaded and during accelleration/braking/kicking-with-your-foot
? Seriously... it looks in the photos that the wire frame is completely smooth, so I just wonder if the bag will slide fore and aft on the frame without much trouble, which I think would be a bad thing.... ?? ...or are they mounted very solidly once clicked on?...oh, and one last thing. The website characterized the bags as "waterproof". Obviously they can't be 100% "waterproof" but has anyone had any experience with these bags in the rain yet? Do they have/need a weather cover to be water-resistent, or is the bag inherently water-tight by design?
thx!
al
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ahhh, our favorite topic from the old board!
Well, my consistent mileage so far is still right at 35mpg. I recently ran the bike for nearly 20 miles after my low-fuel light came on, and it is fairly consistent at 120-130miles.
One of the other members of the board(Jim) was playing with his Power Commander and I think he was getting up to 45mpg.
We've all threatened to do the "run dry/max range" test with a can strapped to the back, but I don't think anyone has done so yet. I suppose I came close with filling the tank with 4.3 gallons after my experiment above.... but who knows. We/I still need to perform the test so I really have an idea of total range.
One thing I've been told again and again is that the mileage will change quite a bit as the engine and transmission loosen-up/break-in. Also, after my first service or two, the dealer will tune it more aggressively.
So... it looks like I'll have to wait a couple/three thousand miles before I know what the consistent/normal mileage is.
I've said it before, and will again... if I can consistently get ~40mpg and about 180-200miles range, I'd be happy.
...but for now, 35mpg isn't too bad. Now I just have to see how much of that 5.5 gallon tank I can really utilize!
al
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Yep, on my bevel-box, there is a 4-inch section along the back edge that has no "wrinkle-coat" ... either chipped-off from the factory, or was never there in the first place... I have no idea. It was never there from when I picked up the bike. I guess just to add my voice to the other masses of customers, I should at least let my dealer know to send it in as a warrantee item. But I doubt I'll care to have it fixed.
But the finish underneath is a satin/flat black and unless you're looking for it, it's really not noticeable. If this is the finish that get's exposed(as opposed to silver aluminum) when the paint bubbles off here and there on the transmission and engine, I can live with that.
...I'd just hate to see big silver splotches start showing up as the "wrinkle-coat" sloughs off.
BTW, your local auto-parts store should have "wrinkle-coat" high-temperature black engine paint. It's relatively common. While this won't be the exact same stuff as the grainy sorta-sparkly Guzzi paint, it should do as a touch-up I would think.
al
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Hi, no... no problem at all
Thanks for the apology, but after re-reading the posts, I can't really see where I could have been offended... although I can now see where ya'll might think I can't spell or assemble a grammatically correct sentence!!
Take care....
al
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....license plate light is gone, gone, gone
But, actually this isn't such a bad thing for two reasons. First, one really doesn't need the plate light, as the tail-light generally casts enough red light through the bottom of the lens to illuminate the plate. OR, since the tail-light is exactly the same as those on older Ducati Monsters, those have a clear window under the lens just for license plate illumination, so in theory one could just change that out it is's important.
Second, you now have a spare set of stock power hookups under your seat
What with disconnecting the license-plate light(BTW, that thing is darned HOT when on!).. you end up with a pair of bullets in the harness under the seat that are now available for any accessory. I wish I had known that before building the much more custom harness for my heated-grips, otherwise I would have just used these connectors later. But no big deal, at least the grips are now on their own fused circuit versus running off of the "lights" circuit *sigh*....So bottom line, yep, you lose the license-plate light... but it's not a big deal at all. Mine is still bolted to the whole old tail assembly... wrapped in bubble-wrap and stored with my old seat
In regard to the soft-bags frame... that's a good question... and an important one. However, as I mentioned in the soft-bag thread, it looks from your photos that the stock bolts required are still retained(it's the bottom set on the new tail). Since everything bolts right up to the same stock subframe, strength and placement shouldn't be an issue. However, I am sure that Kelly will be able to give you some thoughts, and he's very good about guaranteeing his work. I would be very interested to hear "for sure" how it all fits together. It looks OK from the photos, but there's only one way to know for sure... and that unfortunately is to try it.
Oh, and as an alternative to just cutting off the stock fender.... well with all due respect, there really isn't any comparison... other than that both methods do in fact reduce the length of the fender....
I too had manually trimmed my fender on my old FJ1200, with much success. But that was on a 10 year old bike with 60k miles... so I didn't mind taking a saw to the stock part. I didn't feel that comfortable doing the same to my brand new LeMans. And, after looking at the Guzzi fender, it appeared that my results would be less than satisfactory due to the construction of the assembly(so big, so many curves), the license plate light, and width of the fender. I just wasn't convinced that it would result in an outcome I would be satisfied with.... of course that's not to say that someone else may be perfectly happy with a well-done trim job
But there are two substantial things that trimming the fender cannot do in comparison to the unit here, and first that is raising and pulling the indicator lights up and in closer to the tail. They have go to be 6 inches closer together and about an inch higher. Quite a bit different than stock... Perhaps a comparison photo between a stock unit and Kelly's may help illustrate... which I don't have handy... but just compare and you'll see the dramatic difference. It's very striking, and really looks much better in person than the stock solution... well in my opinion anyway! *laugh*
Second, Kelly's kit angles both the tail light and the indicator lights up by 20 degrees or so. So when you are behind the bike, standing, in a car, on another bike... the tail light and indicator lights are focused up into your eyes and are now quite bright and twinkly like jewels
... seriously... especially now that I have running-lights with the Kisan signalMinder product!And it just looks really nifty....
So, again... a really cool product. Kelly only makes a handful, so it is fairly exclusive, but it really cleans up the rear of the bike and sets it apart from other V11s.
Drop him an email if you are interested. I'll be very interested to hear a review and see photos of the newer composite units.... although I am very very happy with my aluminum one!
Take care
al
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YIKES.... I just did the "math" on the currency conversion. That's about USD$1,000 for the aluminum tail!!
I think I'll keep my steel unit al
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Thanks!
Interesting... other than the battery relocation, does this aluminum subframe bolt right up to all the stock locations and accessories? and BTW, where does the battery end up?
Oh, and I wonder if the aluminum frame is as strong as the OEM steel unit?? Since I am no light guy at about 200lb, and I plan to load up my bags for trips... well, I don't want the frame to give out or crack, especially since aluminum will be so much more rigid.
...any thoughts?
al
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...correction, after inspecting my LeMans tonight, it is apparent that the fuel-pump is technically above the left cylinder as noted in the original post. Although it is mostly under the frame, it is offset to the left side and consequently closer to the left head by a significant amount.
However, I believe that most of the previous vapor-lock issues seemed to be reported as related to hoses being too close, especially the left-side. I would inspect that first. All in all, if anyone ever really figures out the problem specifically, it would be great to know the cause.
That "heat shield" for the pump is still a good idea though
BTW, my old FJ had some heat-shield fabric wrapped around many of it's fuel and vaccum hoses. It too was air-cooled, and many of these hoses rested right on top of the head. So this shielding must have worked.
It was almost asbestos-like, with a foil covering and was a narrow sheet, sewn around the hoses. I assume this same material could be had if one looked. It wasn't the most attractive stuff, but it apparently worked!
al
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Some very interesting parts on a Japanese site:
www.guzzisport.com
I sent it through http://babelfish.altavista.com/tr to translate.
I wonder what the story is on those extra frame braces, and the aluminum seat-frame. How well made, sturdy, etc... ?? dunno, but kinda cool looking stuff.
al
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I just finished installing my rear fender eliminator kit from Kelly Baker a couple weeks ago. I was going to post the review right before the board was hacked, so after some delay....
First, before I forget... to contact Kelly:
Kelly Baker's Performance Unlimited
3219 75th Street West
Rosamond, CA 93560
661-256-7246
mgv11sport@yahoo.com
The kit I installed is a two-piece affair that replaces the small plastic inner fender, and the large outside mudflap and license bracket on the rear of all V11 Sport/LeMans. Although my kit is made from aluminum, I believe that all subsequent models from Kelly will be made from some sort of composite such as carbon fiber. As I am not a big carbon fan, I was really excited to get the durability of aluminum, and actually, it's feather light. Kelly may be coerced
into making another aluminum unit, but apparently bending the pieces is quite a pain.Although I don't know what his carbon fiber units will cost, the aluminum verision I installed was about USD$200, and the quality construction and good fit were worth every penny. Further, Kelly took a lot of time and personal attention to make sure everything was right, even offering to make me a complete new unit when I had some fitment problems at the beginning.
You may also note that my unit as installed is powder-coated satin black to match the bike's color-scheme. I had Kelly do that special-order for a few more $$'s, otherwise it would have come in bare metal. I assume future composite units will be black/carbon. But you'll have to contact Kelly to make certain.
Because the installation is so simple and straightforward, I'm not going to detail it here. One merely removes the stock fender, inner-fender, tail-light, and indicators. Then you install the tail-piece that holds the lights and license, tidy-up all the wiring, and then install the rear cover.
Everything uses stock mounting points, and unless like me you want to add one final fastener up top just because there happened to be a hole available... you shouldn't have to modify or drill anything on the bike. It is a very well designed unit. It's really quite a simple unit to install.
The only real modification I made was to add a good deal of black weather-stripping around the tail-light, and as I mentioned above, I ran a screw vertically through the unit into the tail of the bike just for a little more solidity in the mounting. But honestly, this isn't necessary.
I have enclosed photos at:
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/bc/al_roethlisb...nder+Eliminator
If you like what you see, feel free to contact Kelly. I really like the product and think it cleans up the rear-end of the bike dramatically.
But according to him, I have the one and only aluminum non-prototype... and it will be the last... so nyah nyah *wink*
al
BREAK IN
in Technical Topics
Posted
Is this really true?!
YIKES... I wonder how many they wreck that way <_>
Interesting though... So I guess they get that first few minutes of "critical break-in" done for us idiots!
al