Odyssey PC545 question

[Guest ratchethack]

According to the factory Tech manual (also an application manual) that covers the PC545:

 

1. "If the Odyssey battery were to split open, there would be no acid spillage!"

 

2. Per the label on the battery: "Because the Odyssey battery has no free acid inside. . . it enjoys a 'non-spillable' classification. . ."

 

SOURCE LINK: http://www.odysseyfactory.com/documents/US...AM-001_0406.pdf

 

NOTE: This^ mfgr's manual also covers correct charging and maintenance.

[belfastguzzi]

2. Per the label on the battery: "Because the Odyssey battery has no free acid inside. . . it enjoys a 'non-spillable' classification. . ."

Ah so that's why it's called non-spillable. It's only because the acid is held in the mat, not because the battery is totally, completely sealed (though to all normal intents and purposes it is of course sealed).

From what Greg says, his 'experiment' did vent.

I've seen that top port, DH. It doesn't look open. I didn't pull the whole label off as it doesn't feel like there is anything else under it. So where are the rubber valves and where do they escape?

Does that top port break or open in the event of pressure build-up? Or is there a way out through the join between top and case?

[luhbo]

... So where are the rubber valves and where do they escape?

Does that top port break or open in the event of pressure build-up? Or is there a way out through the join between top and case?

 

The rubber caps/valves are below the plastic cover below the words "Odyssey - the extreme battery".

 

Hubert

[Greg Field]

They most definitely will leak juice, if you overcharge them and distort the case, or at least the one I ruined definitely leaked. I've sold hundreds of them through our shop, and only two have failed. One died on its own. I ruined the other trying to revive it after it had gotten weak. You can almost always revive them by whacking them with a high charge rate. That would almost certainly have revived this batter, but I forget to turn off the charger before I went home at night, so I had to buy the customer a new battery.

[rktman1]

For what it's worth, when I replaced the battery in my 03 LeMans with an Odyssey PC545 this is what I found. I posted this in my thread . . .

 

Installed the Odyssey PC545 battery in my 03 LeMans today. It was exactly the same size as the battery that came out of the bike, which was labeled as a SPARK 500, made by Hesa of Milano, Italy for Moto Guzzi. But I swear, the Spark 500 was identical in every way to the Odyssey battery except one: The Odyssey battery had a red top while the Spark 500 had a black top. Because it was the exact same size, installation was a breeze. The old battery had a couple of pads glued to the side to keep it from rubbing on the two outside rails, so I used some weather stripping to do the same. As you know, the battery lies on its "back" with the bottom facing forward and the terminal end (the top) facing towards the rear of the bike.

 

So, I believe the original battery in my LeMans was either made by Odyssey or there is a parent company that makes both batteries: The Spark 500 and the PC545.

[Guest ratchethack]

The case of my OEM SPARK was likewise (for all practical purposes) identical to the Odyssey I replaced it with -- including external dimensions. Like most other mfgrs. of auto and moto parts, battery mfgrs outsource as many components as are most cost-effective to outsource, leveraging significant economies of scale. Though they were manufactured nearly a decade apart, and OEM'd by different companies, the probabilities are high that the cases came from the same injection mold.

[dlaing]

I recall (possibly correctly) the Spark and Hawker are made by Enersys.

The Spark specs seem to match the Hawker Genesis better than the Hawker Odyssey, but the Odyssey is allegedly the better "power sport" battery.

 

Can batteries freeze?

In a partially discharged state, the electrolyte in a lead acid battery may freeze. At a 40% state of charge, electrolyte will freeze if the temperature reaches approximately 16.0°F. The freezing temperature of the electrolyte in a fully charged battery is -92.0°F.

Maybe that is why it leaked????

You can get down to 50% state after about a month pretty easily.

Source http://www.batteryweb.com/faqbw.cfm

[luhbo]

.....

You can get down to 50% state after about a month pretty easily.....

 

Dave, what batteries are used in V11s? You can have them 2 years and more on the shelf without them loosing much charge.

 

Hubert

[belfastguzzi]

You can get down to 50% state after about a month pretty easily.

It would need to be a bad battery, or one that has a drain, without any charge cycle. If not being drained, these batteries will sit for a long time and maintain their charge without any top-up. The down-side is that they are not very powerful.

 

I think a leak is more likely to be caused by over-charge and venting, rather than under-charge and freezing.

[dlaing]

Dave, what batteries are used in V11s? You can have them 2 years and more on the shelf without them loosing much charge.

 

Hubert

Hawker claims "better than 85% charge after 6 months."

But if connected to the bike, my V11 battery loses charge as some current can flow. I suspect this loss is through the ECU.

At least one other on the forum had this problem.

Mine goes down to about 60% charged after about a month.

Pulling the ECU lets it hold a charge much longer.

I don't know what Dennis's state of charge was, how long he went without riding, nor do I know if he left the battery connected.

The alternator on our bikes does not keep the batteries at 100%.

I have an aftermarket Voltage Regulator that charges better at idle, but has less peak voltage, so it has even more trouble maintaining a high SOC. Still if I ride once every two weeks, it keeps starting up. Still I like to give it a periodic charge to bring it up to 100%.

I'll bet if we had everyone go measure their voltage of bikes that have sat at least a day, the average State of Charge would be less than 85%, but that is just a guess.

Hawker says,

"Although there’s no need to follow any special procedure, to get the best results and longest life, charge it prior to storage and store at room temperature or below (the lower the better). Don’t worry about freezing like you might have with regular batteries; this one is designed to withstand temperatures as low as -40o C or -40oF! Disconnect negative cable to prevent any applied electrical storage discharging."

I'd be sure to keep the voltage above 12.6V in freezing places, and above 12.5V elsewhere. Disconnecting and bringing to 12.84V will ensure a long storage life.

[dlaing]

It would need to be a bad battery, or one that has a drain, without any charge cycle. If not being drained, these batteries will sit for a long time and maintain their charge without any top-up. The down-side is that they are not very powerful.

 

I think a leak is more likely to be caused by over-charge and venting, rather than under-charge and freezing.

In general I would agree, but this time of year, I would not bet on it. But if it did freeze, there would probably be plate damage and Dennis probably would not be able to get it to hold a 12.8 +V reading at room temperature for more than a day.

Of course if Dennis said the voltage never got below 12.6V, or he stored the battery in a heated house, and not in an unheated garage in Maine, average temperature at night right now below 10F, and many nights getting below 0F, I would be in complete agreement. FWIW, last January Maine hit an alleged record -50F Was the battery in service then, and how cold was it that night, where Dennis lives?

[belfastguzzi]

In general I would agree, but this time of year, I would not bet on it. But if it did freeze, there would probably be plate damage and Dennis probably would not be able to get it to hold a 12.8 +V reading at room temperature for more than a day.

Of course if Dennis said the voltage never got below 12.6V, or he stored the battery in a heated house, and not in an unheated garage in Maine, average temperature at night right now below 10F, and many nights getting below 0F, I would be in complete agreement. FWIW, last January Maine hit an alleged record -50F Was the battery in service then, and how cold was it that night, where Dennis lives?

I was thinking that in general, there is more likelihood of batteries being overcharged, rather than batteries freezing: but maybe some people are in places where batteries will freeze: thankfully it doesn't get that cold here!

You guys have the additional headlamp-always-on demand on the system. While we have that now on current models, we didn't with the V.11s and their more weedy alternator.

 

Have you observed and traced 'the wet-spot' yet DH?

[dhansen]

I was thinking that in general, there is more likelihood of batteries being overcharged, rather than batteries freezing: but maybe some people are in places where batteries will freeze: thankfully it doesn't get that cold here!

You guys have the additional headlamp-always-on demand on the system. While we have that now on current models, we didn't with the V.11s and their more weedy alternator.

 

Have you observed and traced 'the wet-spot' yet DH?

 

Nope, no sign of any leak. Haven't even checked the voltage on it yet though, hope to mess with it this weekend.

 

Last ride of 2009 was something like December 14th, so it sat in the bike for about a month before I pulled it out. IIRC the coldest night it would have seen was about 15 deg f.

 

We didn't see the 50 below temp here on the coast. That big pond out there moderates the temperature. Did see it 25 below once but that was 26 years ago. Zero is the coldest so far this year. The old Spark 500 battery went through 4 winters here in the bike in an unheated garage (first three years were in San Fransisco) and seemed no worse for it. Always started the bike in the spring without recharging, even in the 7th year when it later died.

 

I am having what could be an issue with the voltage regulator. I've posted about it here before. It is very much intermittent and I doubt serious enough to cause an over charge condition. Could be wrong though!

[gstallons]

Do you own a dVOM or know anyone that does? Do you know how to use one and why you will be using it?

[dhansen]

Do you own a dVOM or know anyone that does? Do you know how to use one and why you will be using it?

 

Yes............ummmmmmmmm, yes and ahhhhhhhhhhhhh, yes!

 

What I really want to do is install a voltmeter to catch the moments when I see the lights get bright and the engine starts missing. As I said, very intermittent and fleeting. I've checked and cleaned most all ground connections (might be something I've missed) and added a ground from the regulator case to the engine. No change.

 

So far, I have not been able to observe voltage readings when the lights are brighter than normal. It only seems to happen when out riding. Every time I've checked voltages with the VOM (in the driveway or garage with the seat off) all has been normal. The bike has been doing this since I got it and given that the original Spark 500 lasted almost 7 years, I doubt that this issue is related to the fluids I found under the battery. Who knows though?

 

Someone from Germany posted here saying they were seeing the same intermittent brightness in their lights but did not mention the missing problem that I get at the same time. I tried PM'ing him but have not received a reply. I'd be interested to know if he ever discovered the cause. I first posted the symtoms I am having about 2 years ago and no one else (except the guy in Germany) has ever mentioned the same problem. I have none of the problems others have had with failed voltage regulators or the wiring associated with them.

 

Blah-ba-blah-ba-blah.