Guest caffreydog Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 Please bear with me, I just brought home my (new to me) 2000 V11 Sport from the recall work last night. I searched the forum, and think it's possible it could be a relay issue but... Went to pick up the bike Monday, but when I got there they noticed the headlight and tailight weren't working. Meanwhile, I knew the tach was not working so the dealer decided to replace the tach while searching for the electrical problem. Picked up the bike tonight and they popped off the seat to show me their fix. They believed the wire sending a signal back to the headlight was 'broken' somewhere, but they couldn't find where. So instead they jerry rigged the relay board by running a green wire from *I think* the 4th to the 1st relay. They swore this would be fine and not cause any issues. See attached photo (gray relay is towards the front of bike). Skip forward to this evening when I go down to the garage to show my wife the new bike and I noticed that the nuetral light was on (no key in the bike) and an intermittent clicking coming from the rear of the bike (presumably under the seat). This started to bother me and so I tried to put the bike in first gear thinking this would turn the nuetral light off. Wrong. When in first gear a humming type noise can be heard from the back of the bike. This worried me more than the nuetral light, so I put her back in nuetral. I took the seat off and noticed the gray relay (1st) is slightly warm to the touch. Please help a newbie out. Any ideas?!? Mark (seem to be having issues with the picture, please excuse if post doesn't come through) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TX REDNECK (R.I.P.) Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 Yes, by all means jump thru your ass, RIGHT NOW & go remove the relays & wait 'til one of the Lektrical guru's gets here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callison Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 Your mechanic is a moron. Remove the relays and fuses for now, then find their "fix" and remove it. Then, we'll go through point by point and find the real problem. Meanwhile, until we can get back to the daylight hours, check out the schematic at: V11 Sport schematic Got any friends nearby with electrical experience - with a meter? It would be a tremendous help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 OMFG <_> ....please be sure to report back to the shop the real "fix" and how theirs almost burned out the already "fragile" balance the Guzzi system is... sheesh A couple of these relays, especially the first relay, are already suspected to be near capacity, and jumpering between them just exacerbates that problem... as well as creating who knows what other electrical gremlins, as you have experienced. Sorry to hear the shop did this to you, especially upon your first experience with the bike. al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murray Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 I would say that your orignial problem was a relay problem. From memory the instrument lights electronic tacho and the ancillary lights except the headlight all run through the same realay. The headlight relay is powered off this circut as well. The wiring is configured in such a way that it will drop out all the lights whilst cranking the motor to ensure maxium starting current gets to the starter. It should then reset however a sticking relay will cause these symptoms which are very much like a broken wire except its very hard to find. As most things are when they aren't there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docc Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 Your mechanic is a moron. Don't sugar coat it, Carl. Go ahead and tell him his mechanic's a moron. Mark, you're in the right place to sort this out. Be patient and you'll find this is an easy , minor issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest caffreydog Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 Everyone, Thanks for the input so far, your combined knowledge is helping set me at ease, and believe that I'll actually get this figured out. Callison, thanks for the schematic, I'm trying to print it out now. I haven't done anything so far. I left my car parked on the street at the dealer's so I could ride home, and it's my only transportation to/from work right now. I'm planning on calling the shop ASAP this morning. Also planning on looking at the schematic, and waiting hopefully for more of your advice throughout the day. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docc Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 It's been said elsewhere but bears repeating: you should pull out all those Siemans relays and replace them with bosch units. More than half your problems will be solved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest caffreydog Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 OK. Severe frustration with 'trained' mechanics sets in. The shop is telling me the two options are: 1. Spend a full day (at $75/hr) looking into the issue 2. Replace the entire wiring harness and associated wiring ($450 just for the part) It seems the consensus is to rip out their hotwiring job and replace the relays with Bosch. Still the case? Does anyone know the part numbers for the Bosch relays and where to get them? I did a quick search of the forum and can't seem to find them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twhitaker Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 I'm sure the part number is listed here but relayshas the Bosh number. Check out the site. There is a plethora of information there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badmotogoozer Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 I haven't done anything so far. Hi Mark, I hope you have pulled the warm relay out at least! If not, go do that now.... Rj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callison Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 OK. Severe frustration with 'trained' mechanics sets in. The shop is telling me the two options are:1. Spend a full day (at $75/hr) looking into the issue 2. Replace the entire wiring harness and associated wiring ($450 just for the part) You mechanic obviously failed the electrical section of his mechanics course. This may be confusing stuff, but it is not that difficult. Dig into the wiring and write down what their "fix" actually is hooked to (we may have to follow the logic of it to see if they did any damage) and then rip their stupid "fix" out. Meanwhile, replace the relays, or at least swap a few around. If the problem persists after the relay replacement, we'll trouble shoot the beast. If we get to that point, you will need to get a meter and print the schematic if possible. Don't worry, we'll get you through it. Surely for less than $75/hr! (my going rate is a beer and some good conversation if we should ever meet, probably the same for everyone else here as well. I'm due to go out to Rochester Mn. for two weeks in June sometime, but I don't think you want to wait that long). Replace the wiring harness??? Sheesh... this guy ain't a mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrt Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Yep, do what Carl sez- He's a lert. Everybody wants to be a lert. Warning- some stream of conciousness follows and I didn't get much sleep last night. If what you say is true (1st to 4rth bridge and 1st is closest to the front of the bike), then most likely you've bridged the starter relay (1) to the ECU relay (4). In the orientation you have pictured (back to front) the relay's should be (but aren't necessarily) (5)Fuel pump, (4)ECU, (3)neutral switch, (2) lights, and (1)starter-but this doesn't make sense with your symptoms. This kind of makes sense if the relays are ordered (left to right in your picture) 1)starter 2)lights 3)neutral 4)ECU and 5)fuel pump and the relays are bridged actually 2 Anyway, take out the wire, replace the relays, and as Carl also says- 99% of the time it's a faulty ground. Check your grounding wires. J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest caffreydog Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Allright. I just picked up the bike from the dealer. The desk clerk told me that their fix was one of the two options (he wasn't sure and the tech wasn't around): from 1st(gray) to 5th(black) OR 1st(gray) to 4th(black). Would either of these make sense with the symptoms? The 1st(gray) relay is towards the front of the bike. What about the grounds? Where do I check to mahke sure they're all connected? For now I just pulled out the 1st(gray) relay and have it sitting on my desk. I'll pop it back in at quiting time for the ride home. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TX REDNECK (R.I.P.) Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 DO NOT GO BACK TO THIS DEALER ! If you were in my area, I would swing by & take a look, or send you to MPH. I know we have several members in the Twin cities area. Can someone go by & help carefreedawg ? I would hate to see his bike catch on fire This is really a simple fix, unfortunatley I lack the vocabulary skills to tell you what to do next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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