No Spark

[callison]

4300? W Oak Hill Dr Chandler, OK 74834, USA, Earth, The Solar System, Milky Way, The Universe, Veils of Maya, God's eye, The Matrix.

(It is amazing what you can find with Google!    )

50490[/snapback]

 

Close. 4045. Don't visit yet though. I ain't there yet.

[al_roethlisberger]

Nice ass house, but 415K? good god man I just spent 184 and I don't know how I'm going to afford that at first. I really need to make 3 times what I do now to be good   

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Yep, houses are NUTS out here in CA, especially in key areas like the SF Bay area, although the "effect" has spread out to almost any city of a reasonable size in the last few years as well.

 

My house, which was built in 1941, is only a 2br/1ba, not quite 1000sq ft... nice, but nothing "special"... will easily sell for north of $550k. A smaller "not as nice" house 3 doors down, and closer to the busy street just sold for $550k even. Heck, a house literally just a few blocks away, almost same house, but in a slightly better neighborhood, just sold for over $699k. It's nuts. I tell ya though, I sure wish I had bought 2 or 3 houses when I moved here 8 years ago. Wow.

 

And forget trying to get into anything bigger, which is what we need(5br/2+ba). Even if we could afford the mortgage(s) on what would be a literally MILLION $+ house, the taxes would eat us up, even though as a %, the property taxes here are low(thank God).

 

I too am worried that the honeymoon has to eventually end as well though, so we're heading out in July. I'd move sooner if we could, but school, work, etc... July it is. So if the market can hold steady for just ~2 more months, we'll be fine.

 

Historically in CA, the real estate market moves in stair-steps, and the last "crash" was around 1989 I think. But typically, the market goes flat, with maybe a 15% drop, then it creeps back up over the next decade again. But we'll see. This last expansion was pretty extreme with people putting all their money into RE following the Stock Market "crash" in ~2000, and the ultra-low interest rates of the last few years.

 

The Fed just bumped the rates again by 1/4 point yesterday, so the pressure is ratcheting up. Again, only time will tell. We'll know when the downturn(or at least stagnation) starts probably only in hindsight... like most things.

 

But, once we do sell, we plan to rent for a year for two reasons.

 

1) We want to figure out where we really want to live. I've learned that rarely can one figure out right away what area of town, etc... one really wants to be in, until after having been there a while.

 

2) In reference to the RE 'crash' comments above, we are going to wait and watch the market to see what happens over the next year. Rising interest rates, high oil prices, RE speculation.... and the fact that everyone and their dog says "buy real estate, it's a sure thing"... makes my spider-sense go off <_>

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now... can we get back to diagnosing my bike's electrical problem

 

 

Heh, but seriously, Moto Italiano has brought in an "outside contractor" type-guy to work on the bike today. He's an EE, builds custom bikes for a living, and is supposed to be a whiz at finding electrical problems, regardless of manufacturer. Jason sent him home with schematics, a printout of this thread, and the official MG training CDs/Videos/Manuals to prep. So maybe today we'll learn something.

 

This is apparently the guy that deduced in about 5 minutes that they could at least get spark by grounding one of the leads from the ECU. ... and that from just walking up and asking what was going on.

 

Anyway, we'll see. Cross your fingers.

 

al

[dlaing]

This is apparently the guy that deduced in about 5 minutes that they could at least get spark by grounding one of the leads from the ECU.  ... and that from just walking up and asking what was going on.

 

50517[/snapback]

In my earlier post I was gonna ask how come they are soooo smart that they knew to ground the lead, but not smart enough to quickly figure out the rest of the problem????

Now we know...

 

 

Good luck with the moves guys.

Al, maybe you should buy Carl's house???

Then you could justify an FJ for commuting

[al_roethlisberger]

heh, Carl's house is too small..... and no offense to Carl, but Modesto?

 

If I have to move to Modesto, I might as well move to North Carolina. Modesto is hot and dusty, Central Valley.... not exactly what the desire to live in "California" is all about IMHO Although to be fair, Modesto is in short striking distance of excellent riding, and more interesting geography/weather.

 

I can get a MONSTER house in NC for $400k, but don't plan to spend that much

 

 

al

[al_roethlisberger]

OK, the latest news/discovery.... they can get the ignition to spark, but not if the fuel-pump is connected. I don't know if they mean the fuel-pump & and the fuel-level sending unit, or just the fuel-pump.

 

But succinctly, the ignition fires with the tank(pump) off the bike, but not with it hooked up.

 

Keep in mind that added a 2003 fuel-pump to the bike, but it hooks up just like the external unit, and I had been riding with it for quite a long while with no issues.

 

And the pump does run/pressurize normally, so it's not shorted out.

 

al

[Cliff]

Have you changed relay. Starting to sound like the relay can't handle the load.

 

The ECU does see the fuel pump at all. The only contact is to drive the relay that energises it and the coils.

The fuel pump will take about 5A continuous. The coils also take about 5-10A for a very short time ( 5ms )

 

Perhaps we need to choose mechanics that have internet access

[al_roethlisberger]

Yep, have the latest greatest relays.

 

I have the Dan's newest heavy duty relay in the #1 slot, and newish Bosch units throughout. They guys at the shop have assured me they have swapped relays around

 

al

[callison]

OK, the latest news/discovery....  they can get the ignition to spark, but not if the fuel-pump is connected.  I don't know if they mean the fuel-pump & and the fuel-level sending unit, or just the fuel-pump. 

 

But succinctly, the ignition fires with the tank(pump) off the bike, but not with it hooked up.

 

Keep in mind that added a 2003 fuel-pump to the bike, but it hooks up just like the external unit, and I had been riding with it for quite a long while with no issues.

 

And the pump does run/pressurize normally, so it's not shorted out.

 

al

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So, let me get this straight. Whenever the pump is in the circuit, the coils etc don't work.

 

 

 

There isn't much on that circuit. The injectors, the coils and the pump. Pump not connected - everything works. Pump connected - nothing works. So it has to be the pump, but the pump sounds like it is pressurizing normally. Was the pump energized while it (the tank) was off of the bike and at that point it sounded normal? Speculating for the moment that while off of the bike, the pump was hooked up with the correct polarity and it worked normally, then perhaps the connector for the pump at the wiring harness side has the polarity reversed. The pump would try to turn but the impeller blades might bind in the reverse direction and then the pump motor would draw its maximum current which would probably be enough current to sag the voltage at the coils and injectors. Or, running in reverse, the pump is trying to draw suction on the very low volume of the injector feed lines and is basically stalling and again drawing maximum current. It doesn't matter that it was working before being brought to the shop if the mechanics start pulling connector pins trying to trace the problem and put them back in the wrong positions. Anything is possible.

[dlaing]

So, let me get this straight. Whenever the pump is in the circuit, the coils etc don't work.

Speculating for the moment that while off of the bike, the pump was hooked up with the correct polarity and it worked normally, then perhaps the connector for the pump at the wiring harness side has the polarity reversed.

I don't know about the internal pump models, but on the external pump models, the connector is idiot proof.

However Al, may have custom wired it in a way that the polarity could be reversed

How about a pinched fuel line???

But maybe you don't have an external pressure regulator.???

Many other possiblities still exist.

Bad ECU, Bad Battery(but it cranks...), Bad connection, Bad injector, Bad Coil

[al_roethlisberger]

The connector is indeed idiot proof on the 2003+ in-tank pumps as well, in fact, probably more idiot proof than the eyelets that bolt to the external pumps

[callison]

So much for that lengthy guess. Okay Al. There's nothing for it. You'll just have to trade me your LeMans for my FrankenSport.

[luhbo]

So, let me get this straight. Whenever the pump is in the circuit, the coils etc don't work.

 

There isn't much on that circuit. The injectors, the coils and the pump. Pump not connected - everything works. Pump connected - nothing works. So it has to be the pump, but the pump sounds like it is pressurizing normally. Was the pump energized while it (the tank) was off of the bike and at that point it sounded normal? Speculating.. ............................

 

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The pump draws maximum current when the pressure in the system is lowest. It's not a piston pump, it works like a turbine. Minimum pressure gives maximum flow or maximum work that leads to maximum current. If it rotates the wrong way, then there is either no difference or the current is lower, because it works less. Should the pump stall because of too much pressure then the current would go down also. Such pumps don't get blocked if they stall, they just rev faster.

If the pump has a electrical defect, then there is a good chance that a fuse would blow because of that shortage.

 

What voltage do you measure at the pump or at the coils, when the pump runs? Before and after the concerning relais? Or before and after some concerning connectors? The pump does not have to be defect, it's maybe just the one component of the three mentioned by Carl that draws the most Amps.

 

Hubert

[jrt]

Kind of an off-beat question, but does anyone know if the pump is magnetic or shaft drive? If it's magnetic, the motor will never stall- it will just decouple from the impeller.

[al_roethlisberger]

Well, I have heard that they had the bike running on Saturday, but no details on what was discovered.

 

I *did* hear that they thought a low battery might have contributed to the "connect the fuel pump and it won't spark" issue, just as many of you had asked about, but I have no real details yet.

 

 

 

What I do know is that there is a nice new scratch through the paint in my tank though, along with lots of other little sworls/scratches in the clear-coat.... although they said they would make it all better, but sheesh...

 

It just gets less and less thrilling as the days go by. Then, by the time I get the bike back, I'll have to turn right around and get it ready for shipment to NC, so won't even get to ride it.

 

...and my plan was to drop it off over Winter to avoid this issue. Then talking to Marcial when he came by the house Saturday to borrow my shop jack, he says he took his bike to Monroes for the case swap, and it literally took 10 days. Nuts

 

 

al

[callison]

there is a nice new scratch through the paint in my tank though, along with lots of other little sworls/scratches in the clear-coat....  although they said they would make it all better, but sheesh... 

al

50953[/snapback]

 

We had a guy here in Modesto take his green V11 Sport to Moto Italiano and they put a lot of scratches in it. He wasn't thrilled about that, so for the transmission rebuild, he sent it to Sacramento. That dealer really fried him so he made MGNA buy it back as a lemon.