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BPR6ES vs BPR6EIX


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#1 antonio carroccio

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Posted 30 July 2005 - 09:34 AM

Hello,

does anyone have experience with the new Iridium spark?

#2 TX REDNECK (R.I.P.)

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Posted 30 July 2005 - 01:16 PM

I tried a set, about the same time as I tried the Nology wires http://www.nology.com/

IMO they both were a waste of $$. BTW I still have those wires. Any offers ?

#3 dlaing

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Posted 30 July 2005 - 06:22 PM

In my opinion, it is best to change the plugs with every valve adjustment, mostly to get a fresh washer for a good seal with less risk to over torquing.
I am far to cheap to spend money on new iridium every valve adjustment.
What might be worth a shot is indexing the spark plugs.
But I doubt one could tell the differnence without ten before and after runs on a dyno.
But it could effect carbon build up levels, etc.
I just got some MSD magnetic suppression wires from http://stores.ebay.com/TPO-Parts
Expensive at $45US, but they should outlast the bike if I don't crash. Plus they are red.
The fluttering on my tachometer is gone :) (EDIT not completely... :( )which may have been caused by faulty noise suppression in my cheap carbon, non-oem wires that I was using. But otherwise fuel consumption is the same.
If it gave me power through efficiency, I should have seen better fuel efficiency, too, but no.
But maybe if I switched from BPR6ES to BP6ES non-resistor and opened up the plug gap a little. :huh2:
In any case, I think the MSD are good reliablity insurance.

I think the Nology recommends larger plug gap.
But what is a bigger spark going to do for me?
I am not missing...I don't think. :huh2:
Maybe it produce more complete burning...possibly at the expense of pinging, as the burn front hits the piston sooner. :huh2:
It might make sense to use nology if you could retard the timing and determine the ideal plug gap.
But then what would you get out of it? 0.1 more miles per gallon and a topspeed of one 12.2 feet per minute faster? Theoretically it makes sense that bigger sparks are better. But I don't think it has ever been proven objectively.

#4 Guest_ratchethack_*

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Posted 30 July 2005 - 06:56 PM

In my opinion, it is best to change the plugs with every valve adjustment, mostly to get a fresh washer for a good seal with less risk to over torquing.
I am far to cheap to spend money on new iridium every valve adjustment.
What might be worth a shot is indexing the spark plugs.
But I doubt one could tell the differnence without ten before and after runs on a dyno.
But it could effect carbon build up levels, etc.

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Dave, I agree. FWIW, I was interested in indexing plugs at one point, remembering that it used to be an old racer's trick back in the days of hemi-head pushrod motors, :blush: :P which presumably benefitted from a more optimized flame-front travel with indexing. I inquired about it a few years back on GuzziTech. Pete Roper replied to my post, saying that (to put it a little more delicately than Pete did -_- ) having a regular morning constitution before a ride would provide a greater benefit to performance than indexing plugs. :D As I recall, either Ed or Todd chimed in and agreed with Pete's assessment. If anyone has a credible comment on indexing plugs on Guzzi's, I reckon it'd be these guys...

#5 txrider

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Posted 30 July 2005 - 08:53 PM

No experience or opinion for that matter on indexing spark plugs but I recall some interesting things written about increasing plug gaps.
Back in the 70's Gordon Jennings and the Cycle magazine crew were making a Ducati 750 GT (called the California Hot Rod) competitive for Daytona, with some success I might add. They had done the whole treatment to the engine including upping the displacement to the rules limit, huge valves and cams and got into the ignition system which was found to be substantially inadequate for the rpm and compression ratio they were running. Their upgrade ended up being a pair of K-Mart auto ignition coils replacing the small oem pair which enabled them to open up the plug gaps from the previous 0.025" to 0.050". That last bit enabled them to get the spark at speed the engine called for and they wrote up the entire project in several Cycle issues. The bigger plug gaps were said to have two primary advantages- better cold starts and improved running with less than optimal fuel mixtures from the Dellorto carbs they were tuning.
This is probably not relevant to our present day bikes, just interesting history on big plug gaps on old bikes. I imagine present day fuel injection makes such changes now pretty much wasted time.

#6 big J

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Posted 30 July 2005 - 11:18 PM

Wasn't that the Cook Neilson bike?A friend of mine built a 900ss to the set up in the magazine. Gawd, now I feel old.

#7 dlaing

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Posted 31 July 2005 - 12:14 AM

Pete Roper replied to my post, saying that (to put it a little more delicately than Pete did -_- ) having a regular morning constitution before a ride would provide a greater benefit to performance than indexing plugs. :D 

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having an espresso triggered regular constitution, helps my performance!
Yah, I know, too much information... :blush:

#8 txrider

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Posted 31 July 2005 - 04:56 AM

Wasn't that the Cook Neilson bike?A friend of mine built a 900ss to the set up in the magazine. Gawd, now I feel old.

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That was the bike. I saved those issues for years then discarded them, unfortunately.

#9 al_roethlisberger

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Posted 31 July 2005 - 05:39 AM

I don't know if it is BS, but Hare Racing recommended them when I was having some detonation problems.

I can't say it cured the problem, as there were several things "wrong" at the time, but I do trust Hare Racing not to steer me toward "snake oil" :huh2:


So take that for what it is worth ;)

al

#10 Guest_Nogbad_*

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Posted 31 July 2005 - 01:38 PM

Spark plug is a spark plug. If the quality of construction is ok and the heat rating is correct for the engine and conditions, I doubt you would notice any difference between the "conventional" construction and the "iridium" one.

Verdict - Bullshit.

That's my :2c: anyway

#11 emry

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Posted 31 July 2005 - 02:07 PM

As I recall the main use of platinum and iridium in spark plugs it to allow longer times between changes. Most cars now use platinum and have 100,000 intervals for changing. Both platinum and iridium is much more resistive to matter transference than the good ol standard plug. Thus the electrode does not wear down, which keeps the gap constant over a longer period of time. Also the smaller electrodes are less prone to fouling due to localized heat. (The electrode's temp is higher due to less surface area=better burn off characteristics.)

Now as for more power. Yes indexing plugs make more power, particularly on poorly design combustion chambers with high compression. Whould we on a guzzi??? Sure a small bit. I think weight reduction through matter expulsion would be a bigger increase in power to weight ratio though. :grin:

#12 gh67

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Posted 26 November 2005 - 07:59 PM

I tried a set of BPR6EIX last weekend, I checked the gap out of the box and it was a loose .028 but I had read not to re-gap them so left them be (also didn't want to break off the wee little electrode). The bike ran like crap once it got up to temp. Would carb fart on me and ping much more than usual. Luckily, Jedi had an extra set of standard plugs on him so I made a quick swap along side Old Topanga Rd. Bike ran great immediately after changing them back....well....I still have a significant amount of pinging under heavy load...but I'm learning to live with it.

So for those who have had success with the NGK Iridiums, what gap did you set them to?

#13 Guest_Nogbad_*

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Posted 26 November 2005 - 08:14 PM

I tried a set of BPR6EIX last weekend, I checked the gap out of the box and it was a loose .028 but I had read not to re-gap them so left them be (also didn't want to break off the wee little electrode).  The bike ran like crap once it got up to temp.  Would carb fart on me and ping much more than usual. 

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Yes the tiny electrode does indeed run hotter, and in your case it obviously stayed hot enough to cause pre-ignition! Gap wouldn't affect this problem at all.

Verdict, use standard plugs!

#14 Mr. Bean

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Posted 26 November 2005 - 08:31 PM

I have the Iridiums in the bike right now...bought them with a coupon so they were almost the same price as the regular ones.

Verdict?

Can't tell the difference at all. I got rid of my pinging and rough running by doing a proper tuneup...the plugs didn't do anything for that.

I did gap them to correctly match the book even though the box said not to.

Once these 4 are used up, back to the cheap stuff :thumbsup:

Randy

#15 Ballacraine

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Posted 26 November 2005 - 08:39 PM

Spark plug is a spark plug. If the quality of construction is ok and the heat rating is correct for the engine and conditions, I doubt you would notice any difference between the "conventional" construction and the "iridium" one.

Verdict - Bullshit.

That's my  :2c: anyway

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Agreed!

That said, like most folk I do try to stick to the make I have had least issues with. I usually buy Bosch out of choice.

...but then that is just my 2 pennorth!

LOL

Nige. B)




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