roberto Posted May 2, 2004 Share Posted May 2, 2004 Well, the usual rattle from the clutch got worse - significantly worse - with an occasional metallic clang before I stopped. The first signs of it was vibration through the clutch lever and a little more noise while changing gear. On investigation I've found that the flywheel centre where it is attached the the crank has separated from the rest of the flywheel, and many cracks are radiating outwards. This also caused the screws on the ring-gear to gouge a track in the gearbox casing, but no serious damage. This has happened about two weeks after my warranty ran out and about 6000 miles since the clutch was replaced last due to excessive noise. I checked out the cost of a standard clutch with flywheel etc. - £600GBP+! A RAM clutch is £275GBP. I heard somewhere that the RAM clutch used on the special guzzis are copies of the RAM design - anyone know about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted May 2, 2004 Share Posted May 2, 2004 I would go to the dealer, and apply for warranty, even if it's out. What if it disintegrated, and you had an accident? I had the same, only mine exploded, and blast through gearbox and engine, after a few month I got a new engine and gearbox from the factory. You are lucky that you stopped early enough, few miles more..... Someone in france had the same. I had the broken clutch parts next to a new ram clutch. They look from the same production. I suppose ram made them for guzzi. So what you see, the first to fail is the centre? Because mine had one crack radiating outwards, And that looked like and old crack, so I thought the crack was first and then the centre. I think the machining of the surfaces isn't in paralel. Or badly balanced. Then vibration makes the alu crack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roberto Posted May 2, 2004 Author Share Posted May 2, 2004 Paul, Did the centre of your flywheel separate from the rest of the flywheel as well? If so, the first crack could be starting there and then the radial cracks afterwards due to the vibration. Note how two radial cracks have met resulting in the separate triangular piece. Also, the centre circular crack was the same diameter as the crankshaft end and shim - could this be significant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted May 2, 2004 Share Posted May 2, 2004 The center was completly seperated and could rotate freely. The center where the bolts and shim are, is a fixed part, were the rest of the disk is vibrating. Your center is loose from the rest? Or partly? Any cracks going to the outside? My clutch had one quarter seperated, that part did the damage to the engine and box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roberto Posted May 3, 2004 Author Share Posted May 3, 2004 Paul, The centre is loose, but only able to rotate about 10 degrees. The material around this circular crack is powdering, and I reckon that it would have progressed so that eventually the centre could have rotated totally freely. If that had happenned, the clutch would have come off the crankshaft totally. I don't think any of the radial cracks have got to the edge yet, but I'll do a dye penetrant test to check this at the end of the week and post the result (I'm having to go to abroad on business this week). Question: Do any of the cracks on your flywheel go through the holes for the ring gear bolts or the pins? Oh, heres the gearbox damage - the silver gouge mark within the gearbox bell-housing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 Roberto, Sorry to hear you've had this happen. What miles did original clutch get replaced? Were all the f'wheel bolts tight & in place? Was f'wheel ass'y correctly aligned with crank? If this is a failure in normal use that's down to manufacture, even tho warranty is up could you approach Guzzi anyhow? Given Paul's experience, they may already know there's a problem. If your dealer isn't interested there may be others that may help. Further I'd be grateful if you did. 3 same failures on this part's got me worried, & it'd be good if Guzzi had knowledge. Paul, had your Scura been apart for work on clutch before it failed? Did Guzzi say anything as to why it broke? Was it out of warranty? Good luck & Thanks, KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gthyni Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 PLS remind me, is this the single plate clutch or the normal multiplate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roberto Posted May 3, 2004 Author Share Posted May 3, 2004 PLS remind me,is this the single plate clutch or the normal multiplate? This is the single plate clutch used on the Scura, Tenni, Rosso Mandello, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roberto Posted May 3, 2004 Author Share Posted May 3, 2004 What miles did original clutch get replaced? Were all the f'wheel bolts tight & in place? Was f'wheel ass'y correctly aligned with crank? The original clutch got replaced at about 7000 miles - the dealer did the work - as far as I know there was no damage other than exessive play between the splines and the friction plate. The flywheel bolts were ok - no cracking near them. Alignment is fine - it's not possible to misalign the clutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 Alignment is fine - it's not possible to misalign the clutch. Roberto, Does the flywheel not have a mark that matches a mark on the end of crank, to show alignment for balance? I thought flywheel/crank/ring gear were matched at factory? I fitted a RAM clutch to my Tonti, if I remember right it was marked to indicate position on crank which I assumed was for balance. Does your flywheel have any machining marks to indicate it has been balanced? Thanks, KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzzi323 Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 Yikes! Sorry to hear about your problems. I'm 2 days outside of my warranty with 20K on the bike. So far the clutch has given me no reason to worry. I'll go on thinking that and tell myself that 20K miles is enough for any problems to show up.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 Roberto, Did you have the transmission replaced at some point? You mentioned having the clutch replaced a while back, but it appears in the photo that you have the correct 2001/2002 textured("fuzzy" bubbling) paint on the engine case, but have the smooth satin finish of the later model bikes on your transmission. These wouldn't have normally come together. I can't imagine it came from the factory that way Did you get the bike that way, was it a used bike, etc??? Maybe theres more to this story than just a replaced clutch a few thousand miles ago, that you might not even be aware of?? al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 Al, if you search the posts from roberto, you see that the dealer has mounted a new gearbox under warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roberto Posted May 3, 2004 Author Share Posted May 3, 2004 Does the flywheel not have a mark that matches a mark on the end of crank, to show alignment for balance? The flywheel has marks for TDC - I will match that up when I fit a replacement clutch, but I don't think the clutch/flywheel will provide balancing for the crank - each unit will be balanced independently. I think the marks are only for timing and I don't use them - I could be wrong and it occurs to me that I didn't check before I removed the flywheel Did you have the transmission replaced at some point? Paul is right. I've had a complete gearbox replacement after the selector sleeve shattered and punched a hole in the casing. In fact, I've had the torque arm, rear drive box, front disks, fork seals, headlamp, clutch, tailpiece, inlet manifolds and gearbox replaced under warranty - and the speedo hasn't worked properly since the gearbox replacement - there's sure to be more, but I can't remember. I'm pretty persistant though - I'll eventually get it all sorted - the bike is worth it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted May 3, 2004 Share Posted May 3, 2004 I think the marks are only for timing - I could be wrong No - I think you're right. Ignore me I was talking rubbish ! Good luck - sounds like you deserve some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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