luhbo
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Posts posted by luhbo
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But the carbed ones had probably nothing you could seriously call idle!
Besides of the quite big inlet diameter my V11 has, these ugly flaps or blades with protruding bolts and a not streamlined axis do look far inferior to the smooth but now retired 40 mm Dell'Ortos I still have (no pump, no choke, just function). And they are crap compared to any modern Keihin or similar...
Hubert
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Yesterday the new "Motorrad" arrived and I found a new picture what could be, IMHO, interesting for this thread, unless it has died already.
It shows the right side of the Kawasaki Ninja ZX-RR and I want to focus your attention to at least one wide-band O2 sensor, making it possible that they are trying to make it faster running it closed-loop.
Hubert
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Do you remember the "Cornish Rebellion" from the Redruth Brewery in Cornwall or is this just too local?
BTW, this could be the beginning of an other great shit war, let me just mention my "prowdly brewed in Bavaria" soul...
Hubert
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Check out this little jewel...... well, it's not little, but it is kinda cool. competes with the wideband commander....
You may also like to explore www.wbo2.com.
I have the DIY version. It went together absolutely smooth.
Hubert
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I just looked at the before mentioned dyno-prices. They want more than $2000 for a complete map. That looks impressive, in deed.
On the other hand, can you guess what a dyno equipement like that costs? I have no imagination, to be honest.
Let me mention an other story to spot my point: actually I have my automatic wrist watch being repaired. The spring is broken, costs about 20,- Euros. They want 140,- Euros for the complete action, and they need only a screwdriver and a magnifying glass.
Hubert
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Hello Carl e.a.
could someone perhaps post a photo of such a stand? I have absolutely no idea of how such a system could look. TLM has no pix also. THX
Hubert
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Todd,
I understand your point. I just checked the PC-site, the new BMW PC is already just one box, all included, even the sensor.
But the rest, they must buy all these mentioned options separately if they decide for a PC. Isn't it this, what causes all this argueing?
Hubert
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Hi Todd,
I am quite sure, that TuneBoy and PC won't interfere as much as it may look at first sight. I don't think that users who have bought the TuneBoy solution will go for PC maps.
An other question came at me while I read your last article: you were announcing a spark-advance plugin, a O2-sensor controller and last a wide-band controller.
Now, does this mean three or even four boxes below the seat?
Hubert
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I think that spark advance is also worthy to be looked at. Nearly all, if not really all ecus resp. ecu-settings have to respect the laws concerning environmental specs. Ignition timing is the first what is adjusted (taken back behind optimum) to reach these values.
The second point is that you need more spark advance if you want to cruise with leaner mixtures. Lambda 1 and higher for cruising at best efficiency should be possible with a big V-twin as well as with every car engine. Making the mixture richer is not always the proper answer.
And last, if someone thinks about dual-plugging his Donna, beeing able to retard the spark should be the first thing he should want to.
Hubert
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Hi Brian,
what John mentions is the My15M from Cliff Jefferies. I have bought it in kit form and had it on the road for about 5000 km. No problems so far!
With this system (it's more than just an ECU) you really have access to all the relevant parameters, be it spark advance, fuel map or things like closed loop or auto-tune. The newest version also supports wideband sensors with 0 to 5V output.
Check it out, I found it to be more than interesting. If you are missing the times when you did understand your bike completely or at least thought so, then this project can be a good link to them.
Hubert
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Actually I work for a factory that produces TPSes for several automotive customers. I can only strongly recommend not to put oil or silicone or something else like this into the potentiometer itself. The risk that you will loose the signal is high. Just leave it as it is, it seems to be quite quite waterproof.
Another thing is the throttle shaft. I have seen on one of the german speaking forums that this shaft can corrode so much that it will get stuck in the throttle body.
This year I tried to prevent this with the help of "gun-oil" what we have here, called "Ballistol". Next season I will try to improve this with some sort of cap put over the TPS.
Hubert
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How about using smaller jets/nozzles combined with higher pressure (and probably some map adjusting)? I think this could result in smaller droplets to make vaporising easyier. Here in Germany someone is selling a different system together with custom manifolds. The spray nozzles are pointing in a different direction. Not towards the valve but instead under the throttle blade. They promise improved responsivness especially under part load conditions. Experimenting this direction will satisfy you probably more.
Hubert
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Hi Todd,
at this point I'd like to thank you and the other guys here in this forum for your will to share your knowledge and feed really substantial information also in topics like this one, and doing this regardless what opinion you have and wether you see things different or not.
It is really a pleasure and most interesting to be here and read through the posts. This goes to Jaap also, of course, hosting this site.
Hubert
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Someone here in Germany sells an ignition unit with a what he calls twin spark feature (or is it even triple spark?).
With low revs the coils do not produce only one spark per stroke (the right stroke o.c.) but two or even more, very fast one after the other. This shall produce a better idle and better cold start.
Perhaps Antonio was after something like that?
Hubert
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Plain and simpel, in fact! That's easyier then I thought. You just use the original injection impuls as a trigger for your own injection signal. And the lenght of this signal is not calculated, it's just read out of a map. That's what one could call a hack! So it seems that the decision of the OEMs to stop others to fool their ecus made things even better for those.
Anyway, this foolproof system should make it a bit difficult to alter spark-advance, shouldn't it?
On the other hand, if things are so straight forward, wouldn't it be possible to offer the possibility to use more than just two maps (two means those for the cylinder offset)? More than those 2 would give you the possibility to switch between a highload configuration, an economy configuration and maybe also a quite lean/rich traffic-control configuration which could make your mufflers sound a bit less italian!
A standard 32K eeprom should provide enough space for quite some maps like this, with no additional costs!
Hubert
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This individual cylinder mapping provided by the PCIII really looks interesting, the more as the WM ecus IMHO do not know such a
feature.
As I have understood the PC concept this unit is just cheating the ecu by modifying the sensor values. So the possibilities it has directly depend on the sensors that the bike offers. In this special case it would mean that after the first injector has fired the reading of let's say the pressure sensor has immediately to be faked so that the ecu thinks it has to provide more juice with the next injection.
Now what will happen when our italian fellows at Magneti Marelli and/or Guzzi and/or Aprilia just change the charakteristics of their sensors, what they do sometimes, or deliver european ecus with US software in swiss bikes, re-imported then to maybe the netherlands? These scenarios always did and do happen, it's just the genius of the italian manufacturers that nevertheless always great bikes were put on their wheels, regardless what actual version of wire-harness was used in september to fit the ecus they had at hand then.
It seems to be a great job what the aftermarket suppliers do to stay on the ball in this game.
Hubert
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I think that it might be possible to program their lambda system to give out 0-1 Volts, but if Cliff will provide 0-5 V input range for the sensor in My1XM that is even better.
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Techedge seems to also offer some miniature version especially for motorcycle use. It does not have those datalogging capabilities but with My1XM you don't really need those, because the ECU can be used to do the datalogging instead.
br, JuhaV
The 2AO system already has a simulated narrow-band output from 0 to 1 Volt. I think I can use it just instead of the signal cable of my actual probe.
I bought this unit, because first it was available, second it is DIY and probably a good bit cheaper, and third because I can use this together with its logging capabilities on my other bikes, too. The next will be the Laverdas of my fellows, so the price for it really goes ok!
Hubert
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Hi Juha e.a.,
Saturday the Techedge WBO2 kit arrived. After some weeks it finally passed through our customs. I had to pay another 16% taxes.
The kit comes in surprisingly good condition. The parts are all labeled by someone by hand, are complete and are packed individually for the display, the cable and so on.
The housing components are ready drilled and machined, also very very accurate. Besides that some parts or cables are bit tiny and you so have to be carefull with them it is really a pleasure to build up the kit.
It is the same with the instructions. Well done and with lots of pictures, there is even one where most of the parts are individually pictured in case you cannot make a difference between resistors and capacitors. Anyway, it's been the first time I had to deal with a thermal resistor, so it was helpfull indeed.
Sunday night I had finished it, and guess what: I powered it up and all worked as it should! The display shows something about 45, but when I hold the probe in a butan stream it goes down to 25 or so, holding it in a butan flame shows values down to 10. I played not much with it like this, because the probe tip gets red quite easily this way.
BTW, Cliff announced support for controlled wide-band sensors like this (0-5V) and also further improvements for the autotune capabilities of my1Xm, so for me it was already enough winter this season...
Hubert
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The ecu has an inbuilt correction mechanism. The pressure sensor will affect the applied correction factor. But wether this and other influences are correct could only be verified by running the ecu in closed loop.
I remember having read somewhere, that Marelli f.i. uses first hand the map values, but then when the engine runs static the ecu begins to lean out the mixture to reach the values the traffic authority likes. But I am not sure.
Some folks also think you cannot change your original mapping without switching off the O2 sensor, because the ecu seems to notice that something has changed and also seems to be "learning" to reduce the mapped fuel amount to reach the correct values again!
The point is always: they tell you so or so and then offer you the best solution the market has, what is surprisingly always their system.
Hubert
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I will also throw in here my "old" question : How do you adjust your map correctly in the mid range (partial throttle) if you are using an inertia type (not brake type) dyno ? I still have the impression that inertia type dynos simulate mainly the full throttle acceleration situation. Please advice if this is not correct interpretation.
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br, JuhaV
I think it's just a question of the inertia the dyno has. I have never seen one in action. If it takes two seconds to redline the bike, then it could be quite useless for everything else but full throttle. If it takes 20 seconds, then it should work like a static one and give similar results.
You should also take in account how fast your ecu can store the results or how fast your lambda-probe reacts and so on...
If you ask your dealer, the answer probably depends on what system he has.
Hubert
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No no no no, personally I'm dreaming from different things. That's not my site. It's an interesting one anyway.
Hubert
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Look here, how the proper use of grinding tools can help your ego!
http://www.taunus-biker.de/~mdvp/Mille/Rubbel.jpg
Hubert
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Hi Juha,
I was thinking about buying a new narrow band sensor and mount it instead of the one I have now. This probably has more then 100,000 km, I have removed the tip-cover and welded the whole thing on a drilled M12 bolt. These parts were all that I had at hand when I decided that that was the sunday to bring it to an end. Then I looked around and found that new sensors are not cheap at all! Ebay sells them for approx. 50,- Euros, shops not below 100,-. Still using such a probe means "living on the edge". Look alone at the effects different temperatures have, especially at the wanted 0.8 volts.
I now bought a kit from tech-edge, that comes complete with controler, cable, Bosch LSU4, display and logging software for about 250,- Euros when I remember right. It is on its way now since more than 2 weeks, the money is paid even longer. The main reason to buy it besides the better accuracy was the option to use it also on other, Dell'Orto bikes.
I will tell you when this stuff finally has arrived...
Hubert
....joking about calling Jaap a "Tukker" 
ECU
in Technical Topics
Posted
An other part that would not fail!