Ballacraine Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 OK, folks.... Here I am again pumping you all for information. I'll start by saying I really do like the performance of the single plate clutch on my Scura. It is a world apart from the lugubrious heavy units fitted to the 750-S3 & LM1 & 2. I am still worried about the reliability issues with the single plate unit. My question is aimed at those of you fortunate enough to have owned or ridden V11s with the twin plate and the single plate set up. How does the standard two plate fitted to the V11 compare? Does the two-plate item noticably compromise the engine acceleration? My follow-up question is, how much can the standard two-plate item be lightened? Thanks for all input. Nige. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_roethlisberger Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 Since I personally haven't ridden a SP clutch bike, I can only offer the following: 1 - I find the DP clutch to be very easy to pull, and works flawlessly 2 - I have been told that the late-model DP clutches are actually quite light in comparison to older models 3 - Yes, they can be lightened, but again, from what I've been told the new DP clutches are pretty light already. And for a street bike, they work well to smooth the idle and drivetrain, without being a "drag". Hopefully someone who has owned/ridden/worked-on both can offer more specific comparitive details. But just as compared to other(more modern?) bikes I've owned/ridden, the DP clutch seems just fine in comparison. al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nogbad Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 My 00 Sport with DP clutch is light and progressive at the lever, and I never notice any lag in engine acceleration. It's rattly when disengaged and I tend to select neutral whilst still rolling to avoid holding the lever when stationary as I don't like the "bag of rattling spanners" noise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrt Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 The sport dual plate is a much lighter flywheel than the old boat anchors. That's for dang sure. It works very well, and frankly there's not a large difference between the clutch feel on my sport and the RAM unit I put on my Eldorado. The sport is a little better feel because it's hydaulic...but that's about it- both are smooth and predictable. It's good you don't idle with the clutch pulled in, Nogbad. It's hard on the input and clutch splines. Put 'er in neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballacraine Posted May 16, 2005 Author Share Posted May 16, 2005 The pick up of engine speed using the single plate seems very impressive to an old Guzzisti. If possible I don't want to lose much (if any) of that. This is the root of the dilemma! Thanks for your comments, folks... Appreciated. Nige. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeBenGuzzi Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 I just Throw the bike into one of my False neutrals and then downshift to 1st or neutral depending on if I need to stop or do a rolling stop. I have to find some use for them all I don't engine brake as much as most or as much as I could I've always been a preservist in that brakes and pads are much cheaper than rings and pistons maybe its hogwash but its what I'm used to now and engine braking a Goose is stronger than the back brake and maybe I want to coast? ANYway I'm working on engine braking more now that when it got backed into and the lever was gone all I had was the back and engine to go 3 miles in city to the dealer <_ about the original topic i have no real idea would think a dp clutch be better all-arounder and mine isn as heavy my cruiser was so there. src="%7B___base_url___%7D/uploads/emoticons/default_bbblll.gif" alt=":bbblll:"> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Dave Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 I have three EV Tourings, one with a single plate clutch, one with an original dual plate clutch, and one that the single plate has been replaced with a dual plate. Although not a V11, the comparisons are easy to make. The single plate is much lighter to operate (all are cable operated), and does appear to spin a little more readily. But can't say I appreciate the difference otherwise when riding, even in an aggressive manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big J Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 The pick up of engine speed using the single plate seems very impressive to an old Guzzisti. If possible I don't want to lose much (if any) of that. This is the root of the dilemma! Thanks for your comments, folks... Appreciated. Nige. 51864[/snapback] I dont know the diameter of the clutch (about 9 inches?) but i wouldn't think the additional mass of an extra plate on a radius of 4 1/2 inches would be that great. If you're working on aircraft, you could put your flywheel/clutch in a compressor or turbine balance rig and simulate the weight of a second plate with plasticene, then time acceleration rate to compare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nogbad Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 I dont know the diameter of the clutch (about 9 inches?) but i wouldn't think the additional mass of an extra plate on a radius of 4 1/2 inches would be that great. If you're working on aircraft, you could put your flywheel/clutch in a compressor or turbine balance rig and simulate the weight of a second plate with plasticene, then time acceleration rate to compare. 51918[/snapback] Nice experiment, but would it be worth tearing the engine and tranny apart just to do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big J Posted May 16, 2005 Share Posted May 16, 2005 It's a Scura, he'll have the clutch out soon enough anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Stewart Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I dont know the diameter of the clutch (about 9 inches?) but i wouldn't think the additional mass of an extra plate on a radius of 4 1/2 inches would be that great. If you're working on aircraft, you could put your flywheel/clutch in a compressor or turbine balance rig and simulate the weight of a second plate with plasticene, then time acceleration rate to compare. 51918[/snapback] I need a drink Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pierrot Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I changed the clutch on my v11sport 00 skipping from DP to SP (before having heard of any failure ). The difference is important and thanks to lower inertia, accelerations are much better, especially at low rev. In counterpart, the engagement point is very far and it is necessary to adjust the lever to have the maximum stroke. Furthermore, as the inertia is reduced, noise at idle increases a lot. I don't regret my choice so far, but it's hard to ride crossing my fingers Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 ...The pick up of engine speed using the single plate seems very impressive to an old Guzzisti. If possible I don't want to lose much (if any) of that.... Ballacraine, I put a RAM unit in my Tonti (had a LM11 dp unit in before ). Pick up is much quicker & action, very much lighter. But I think the modern dp units are already lighter than old roundhead ones, so difference may not be comparable. Have you considered replacing with a genuine RAM sp unit? This is my thought if mine shows any problems or if failure is shown to be inevitable (which I don't believe it has been). Last time I enquired, Motorworks were doing them for what seemed very reasonable money. I have not heard of anyone having problems with those. I notice Goffredo has not come back with any more info after his assertions about the sp on another thread. KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballacraine Posted May 17, 2005 Author Share Posted May 17, 2005 I dont know the diameter of the clutch (about 9 inches?) but i wouldn't think the additional mass of an extra plate on a radius of 4 1/2 inches would be that great. If you're working on aircraft, you could put your flywheel/clutch in a compressor or turbine balance rig and simulate the weight of a second plate with plasticene, then time acceleration rate to compare. 51918[/snapback] I expect that it really depends on how much more substantial the basket / flywheel is on the two plate unit. I would expect it to be heavier in addition to the extra weight of a clutch plate. We do have centrifuges but foreigners are a little awkward. Thanks for the suggestion though. Nige. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballacraine Posted May 17, 2005 Author Share Posted May 17, 2005 Have you considered replacing with a genuine RAM sp unit? This is my thought if mine shows any problems or if failure is shown to be inevitable (which I don't believe it has been). Last time I enquired, Motorworks were doing them for what seemed very reasonable money. I have not heard of anyone having problems with those. KB 51986[/snapback] Yes, that is one of the options I am leaning towards. It would appear that they have quietly redesigned the profile of the flywheel. It seems to be more substantial around the boss area. Whether this has cured 'the problem' though is still an open question. I would think it would certainly have to help though. Nige. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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