Barber Vintage Festival 2025

[swooshdave]

3 hours ago, Goofman said:

Thanks for sharing the photos of your Barber's Vintage trip.   I've actually been to the first 12 or so; got several of the same shots in the Museum (not of Bucees).

It does inspire me to go again.  I'm trying to talk my 81 years old brother into going, but health issues have delayed that trip.

I am very fortunate to be able to go with my brother and my friends.

[audiomick]

44 minutes ago, swooshdave said:

... Getting good sound at an event like that is nearly impossible for anyone but professionals and even then it would be a challenge. 

I beg to differ.

Yes, the "right" gear is very, very expensive, and most people don't have it. Making the most out of what you have is, on the other hand, merely a matter of understanding what is causing the problems, and improvising. Like I said: wind protection on the mic, and figuring out how to edit such that there is no click in the audio.

What do I know about audio? Only as much as about 40 years as a sound technician teaches one. 

Whatever, it is great that the man makes the effort to make the videos. My motivation is more to try and give him tips to make it better than to wantonly criticise his work. 

Edited Tuesday at 11:05 PM by audiomick

[audiomick]

36 minutes ago, audiomick said:

... Like I said: wind protection on the mic,...

Incidentally, if one is working outdoors, that is the first thing that one takes care of. Because it is fairly easy to sort out, and makes a huge difference.

[docc]

I went to the Barber Vintage Festival for ten years (missed its first year). Ended up building a couple great routes there and back without using the "Interstate" or major highways.  200-280 miles / 320-450 km of backroads, valleys, and ridge crossings, bypassing every town possible. Just fabulous.

The event, itself, is equally fabulous and the video really stresses how the attendees, how the myriad, unparalleled motorcycle-ism is intoxicating, even overwhelming. 

I so appreciate the "man on the ground" style of the video as I felt I was walking around with my friends, hearing the gentle chatter in the background, bikes being started and revved; the passersby, the tram ride; always the racing going on.  

Looking forward to Part 2 ! (Part 3?)

[audiomick]

9 minutes ago, docc said:

... the "man on the ground" style of the video...

Yes, he captured that very well. 

[swooshdave]

1 hour ago, audiomick said:

Incidentally, if one is working outdoors, that is the first thing that one takes care of. Because it is fairly easy to sort out, and makes a huge difference.

The reality is that he went there with just the idea of capturing video and it was my fault for coming up with the interviews. So we did the best with what we had. Which was not a lot. He had to massively tweak the audio to take out the excessive noise of racing bikes, etc. If you heard the raw audio you would be impressed it came out at all. 

[docc]

21 minutes ago, swooshdave said:

The reality is that he went there with just the idea of capturing video and it was my fault for coming up with the interviews. So we did the best with what we had. Which was not a lot. He had to massively tweak the audio to take out the excessive noise of racing bikes, etc. If you heard the raw audio you would be impressed it came out at all. 

It made me feel like I was (back) there. 

Thanks for the memories.  

 

[audiomick]

35 minutes ago, swooshdave said:

... he went there with just the idea of capturing video...

and no audio at all? I don't believe that. Ok, I'm being a bit provocative, but bear with me.

The audio is mostly good, and it is obvious from the end result that he is working with a program that can do relatively elegant things with the audio, independant of the video edits.

What disturbs me is the wind noise in some segments, and the clicks  and jumps in quite a lot of the edits.

As far as the wind noise goes, if audio is being recorded at all, particularly outdoors, that should be taken into consideration. Coping with it is not that hard, and not expensive. Sure, one can spend quite lot of money on "audio transparent" wind shields, but one can also achieve very good results with a block of cheap, lightweight foam rubber, or maybe a couple of layers of nylon pantyhose. If nothing has been brought along to cope with that, taping a sock over the microphone would also help. 

As far as the edits go, as mentioned, he is obviously working with a program that can do a fair bit with the audio. Doing a cross-fade across the edits, or a fade-out and fade-in, should be possible, and would improve the end result considerably. 

Edited yesterday at 01:28 AM by audiomick

[Pressureangle]

11 hours ago, audiomick said:

and no audio at all? I don't believe that. Ok, I'm being a bit provocative, but bear with me.

The audio is mostly good, and it is obvious from the end result that he is working with a program that can do relatively elegant things with the audio, independant of the video edits.

What disturbs me is the wind noise in some segments, and the clicks  and jumps in quite a lot of the edits.

As far as the wind noise goes, if audio is being recorded at all, particularly outdoors, that should be taken into consideration. Coping with it is not that hard, and not expensive. Sure, one can spend quite lot of money on "audio transparent" wind shields, but one can also achieve very good results with a block of cheap, lightweight foam rubber, or maybe a couple of layers of nylon pantyhose. If nothing has been brought along to cope with that, taping a sock over the microphone would also help. 

As far as the edits go, as mentioned, he is obviously working with a program that can do a fair bit with the audio. Doing a cross-fade across the edits, or a fade-out and fade-in, should be possible, and would improve the end result considerably. 

I think you're falling into what I call the 'expertise trap'. 
When we've done something over a lifetime, particularly if it's something we enjoy, we tend to forget how difficult it was at the start and how long it took to become proficient. 
Personally, I absolutely dread editing videos. The burden of reviewing hours of footage, learning the program to cut it apart and assemble the pieces, smooth the changes, insert/edit audio, tracks, noises...etc. At this age I am simply unwilling to put in the hours at all, let alone to do it well. 

But my example for the blindness of expertise; I had to teach an Army A/C tech. His job was to go find someone who could do his job. So I taught him the recovery machine, but diagnosing functional failures I learned that he had heard the word 'electricity' but he was so ignorant of how it worked I had to back down all the way to showing him the + and - on a battery and explain not only why wires had colors, but *how wires worked*. That brought into focus that my blind assumption was that because he was there with the rating that he knew anything at all. 

To the point, it's easy to criticize what is easy to us and forget how awful our product was at the same point in practicing. 

Ok, it's early and I haven't sipped my coffee and I've been thinking a lot about the fall of Western Civilization. Don't let me drift this into a philosophy thread. 

[swooshdave]

Here's the second (and last) installment for your enjoyment... or in some cases, a source of ire. 

This one has some very well known names being interviewed. 

[audiomick]

3 hours ago, swooshdave said:

... in some cases, a source of ire. 

As far as I'm concerned, not at all. As I already mentioned, I'm mosty concerned with trying to help make the result better. 

What @Pressureangle wrote might be true, although I'm very aware of the "problem". I regularly have to deal with apprentices, and regularly realise that things that I consider to be common knowledge are actually things they have never thought about.

11 hours ago, Pressureangle said:

I think you're falling into what I call the 'expertise trap'. 

Whatever, lots of interesting stuff in the video. I'd almost be inclined to go there just to see the Artworks that Allen Millyard built. 

Despite this

11 hours ago, Pressureangle said:

Don't let me drift this into a philosophy thread. 

I'm going to philosiphise a bit.

Video is something that you have to actively look at. Sound is "just there". You can close your eyes and ignore the video, but even if you stick your fingers in your ears, you can still hear something.

If you go into a cafeteria, a diner, whatever, with a hard floor, hard walls, bare glass, it is not a pleasant place to be in. Even if the food is excellent, you're not really comfotable. In contrast, if you go into a restaurant with carpet on the floor, thick curtains, pictures on the wall to break up the flat surface, it is a nice room to be in. Even if the food is "only" good, you'll go out with a memory of a pleasant evening.

Most people don't really give any thought to this. They see conciously, but hear sub-conciously. So a video with mediocre audio is like the cafeteria: the pictures might be really good, but the total experience isn't. A video with good audio is like the restaurant with carpet on the floor and so on: if the audio is good, even pictures that are "just good" have a much better chance of coming away as being a really good video.

Getting back to the second video: there is some quite good stuff in there, as in the first. Fading in the voices before the interview pictures is quite neat. Underlaying music in some segments is also quite neat. That this has been done shows that the program that is being used can do everything that is required to do polished edits.

For the longish sequence in the museum, where there doesn't have to be any direct relationship between the audio and the video, it would be a good tactic to record ten minutes or so of background noise (the professional term is "atmo"), and just let that run through instead of taking the audio from the bits that were edited together.

For the sequence in the paddock, where it is relevant to hear the bike starting that you see being kickstarted in the video, do the cross-fade over the edit. I'm pretty sure the program should have an automatic function to do that sort of thing.

And figure out how to eliminate the wind noise.

And thanks for the videos. 

PS: I was quite surprised to see Heidenau Tires popping up a couple of times. I didn't know that they have a presence in the U.S.A. . They are a relatively small company about 130 k.m. (80 miles) from where I live. I have their K34/K36 combination on my V35 Imola.

https://shop.heidenau.com/en/zweiradreifen/motorrad.html?___from_store=de

 

 

Edited 17 hours ago by audiomick

[docc]

17 hours ago, swooshdave said:

Here's the second (and last) installment for your enjoyment... or in some cases, a source of ire. 

This one has some very well known names being interviewed. 

I love this so much. Thank you for taking me along when I have not been able to get back there for so long .  .  .

The sights and the sounds are so comforting, reminding me of my ten years there. The special interviews with Peter Egan, @Corey Levenson, and  @swooshdave (himself!) are just extraordinary.

That the sound is raw and unaltered makes the experience better for me. Having actually been there, I appreciate the raw take on the audio.

That my ears ring all the time and my bandmates are suspect of my hearing should be considered in this matter of "audio" opinion . . .

[swooshdave]

12 hours ago, docc said:

I love this so much. Thank you for taking me along when I have not been able to get back there for so long .  .  .

The sights and the sounds are so comforting, reminding me of my ten years there. The special interviews with Peter Egan, @Corey Levenson, and  @swooshdave (himself!) are just extraordinary.

That the sound is raw and unaltered makes the experience better for me. Having actually been there, I appreciate the raw take on the audio.

That my ears ring all the time and my bandmates are suspect of my hearing should be considered in this matter of "audio" opinion . . .

Mike had no idea who Peter Egan was.  I was reading Peter in Road & Track when I was in Jr. High and later in Cycle World. So for me it was awesome to get him on camera.

For you non-Norton people it was equally special to get Brian Slark too. While now he is the curator for the museum back in the day he worked at Norton. And he later had a dealership in CA. One of my Nortons has his sticker on the side cover.

 

[swooshdave]

14 hours ago, audiomick said:

As far as I'm concerned, not at all. As I already mentioned, I'm mosty concerned with trying to help make the result better. 

What @Pressureangle wrote might be true, although I'm very aware of the "problem". I regularly have to deal with apprentices, and regularly realise that things that I consider to be common knowledge are actually things they have never thought about.

Whatever, lots of interesting stuff in the video. I'd almost be inclined to go there just to see the Artworks that Allen Millyard built. 

Despite this

I'm going to philosiphise a bit.

Video is something that you have to actively look at. Sound is "just there". You can close your eyes and ignore the video, but even if you stick your fingers in your ears, you can still hear something.

If you go into a cafeteria, a diner, whatever, with a hard floor, hard walls, bare glass, it is not a pleasant place to be in. Even if the food is excellent, you're not really comfotable. In contrast, if you go into a restaurant with carpet on the floor, thick curtains, pictures on the wall to break up the flat surface, it is a nice room to be in. Even if the food is "only" good, you'll go out with a memory of a pleasant evening.

Most people don't really give any thought to this. They see conciously, but hear sub-conciously. So a video with mediocre audio is like the cafeteria: the pictures might be really good, but the total experience isn't. A video with good audio is like the restaurant with carpet on the floor and so on: if the audio is good, even pictures that are "just good" have a much better chance of coming away as being a really good video.

Getting back to the second video: there is some quite good stuff in there, as in the first. Fading in the voices before the interview pictures is quite neat. Underlaying music in some segments is also quite neat. That this has been done shows that the program that is being used can do everything that is required to do polished edits.

For the longish sequence in the museum, where there doesn't have to be any direct relationship between the audio and the video, it would be a good tactic to record ten minutes or so of background noise (the professional term is "atmo"), and just let that run through instead of taking the audio from the bits that were edited together.

For the sequence in the paddock, where it is relevant to hear the bike starting that you see being kickstarted in the video, do the cross-fade over the edit. I'm pretty sure the program should have an automatic function to do that sort of thing.

And figure out how to eliminate the wind noise.

And thanks for the videos. 

PS: I was quite surprised to see Heidenau Tires popping up a couple of times. I didn't know that they have a presence in the U.S.A. . They are a relatively small company about 130 k.m. (80 miles) from where I live. I have their K34/K36 combination on my V35 Imola.

https://shop.heidenau.com/en/zweiradreifen/motorrad.html?___from_store=de

 

 

Look, I fully understand the value of audio. I know you are just trying to provide constructive criticism but..  a) I'm not the owner of the channel, I just contribute. The owner will never see your comments. b) Shooting unscripted and ad hoc in a difficult environment is a massive challenge. You do the best you can. If you watch other videos on that channel you'll see that in a controlled environment more care is taken with the audio. c) In the rapid world of YouTube getting the content out far outweighs scrutinizing every edit point. No one is getting paid here, it's just a hobby.

Life is short, enjoy the amateur videos for what they are.

Heidenau tires have actually been feature on the channel. So yes, they are here.

[Pressureangle]

17 hours ago, audiomick said:

PS: I was quite surprised to see Heidenau Tires popping up a couple of times. I didn't know that they have a presence in the U.S.A. . They are a relatively small company about 130 k.m. (80 miles) from where I live. I have their K34/K36 combination on my V35 Imola.

https://shop.heidenau.com/en/zweiradreifen/motorrad.html?___from_store=de

 

 

Heidenau tires are getting a lot of traction in the ADV community.

Pun completely intended