callison Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Courtesy of Todd Haven on the (newly revived) WildGuzzi Forum: Well, The oft-delayed Breva 1100 has been delayed once again. Seems the bike has yet to pass the "SHED" test in California. http://www.webberemi.com/SHED%20Brochure%20.htm The muckity-mucks(best word I can use without risking a ban this early on) at MGNA have decided no bikes will be importd to the U.S. untill they are 50-states approved. We've been told that "California dealers would be upset" if other dealers were able to offer a product unavailable to Ca. dealers. I wholeheartedly concur! What a horrible precedent to set. Wink Look for the Breva 1100 sometime in November, but I'm betting on a week before Christmas. Oughta fly off the showroom floor. New leadership takes over Jan 1, 2006. This is good news. Despite my tone above, I am truly upbeat about the coming changes. What a long, strange trip it's been.. Todd Haven MPH Cycles www.mphcycles.com --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, it's going to be deep into winter before the Breva shows - if ever. Might as wait for the Griso. A Ural side-car hack is beginning to look ever more reasonable and definitely more obtainable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve G. Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 My local dealer says Canada won't see them till next May. Maybe. It is of my opinion that air cooled pushrod [read inefficient] engines are going to quickly find it tougher and tougher to pass these kind of tests. Time for Guzzi to start working on that 4 valve water cooled lump again. Ciao, Steve G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Hey Carl, If you don't like California, why don't you just move to Oklahoma!?! FYI The SHED test is the same for 2004-2007, so Guzzi blew it!...even with dual plugs and lower HP. Why does everyone bash on California?! We need pollution control standards. Guzzi could have easily passed the test. Everyone should bash the Breva!!!!! Maybe it is the closed loop O2 sensor messing up the Breva on the SHED test???? The 2008 model year is gonna be a BEEEATCH! They'll need MotoLab to re-map every bike entering our ports!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callison Posted October 11, 2005 Author Share Posted October 11, 2005 Hey Carl, If you don't like California, why don't you just move to Oklahoma!?! FYI The SHED test is the same for 2004-2007, so Guzzi blew it!...even with dual plugs and lower HP. Why does everyone bash on California?! We need pollution control standards. Guzzi could have easily passed the test. Everyone should bash the Breva!!!!! Maybe it is the closed loop O2 sensor messing up the Breva on the SHED test???? The 2008 model year is gonna be a BEEEATCH! They'll need MotoLab to re-map every bike entering our ports!!! 62753[/snapback] What if it were just the emollients outgassing from the new tires? MG doesn't have enough money to grease the palms of the smog crew in California where other manufacturers consider that part of the development costs. If MGNA wants a 50 state bike and can't afford the bribes, there will never be a new Guzzi shipped to the USA again and that will be the end of that. I agree that the technical reasons for smog controls are necessary and they do work. The political and administrative beauracracy surrounding smog certification in the great state of Kalifornia is one of the crookedest and self-serving nightmares ever served against a paying public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 I suppose that Arnie was going to solve this, the voters hoped for? But as long as his Hummer is allowed, why should he care? Here is this showmaster with his airplane engine registerd? Carl, IF there is a breva 1100 for you, the longer you have waited for her, the happier you are with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twhitaker Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 I hope you don't think I jinxed the Breva October delivery. If I weren't such a pessimist I would be an optimist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeve Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 FYI The SHED test is the same for 2004-2007, so Guzzi blew it!...even with dual plugs and lower HP.Why does everyone bash on California?! We need pollution control standards. Guzzi could have easily passed the test. 62753[/snapback] You're right; we do need pollution control standards. But CARB has outlived their usefulness, and now just promotes ever tightening standards to continue their own bureaucratic existence! You do realize that automobiles are no longer the primary source of air pollution in CA, right? Yet CARB pursues ever diminishing returns against cars (& the incredibly low percentage of drivers, motorcycles) instead of doing what really would have an impact, ie [in order of increasing importance:] nailing all the Mexican registry vehicles on our roads [much larger number in SoCal than motorcycles throughout the state, much worse polluters; you wouldn't BELIEVE these rattletraps!], shutting down the the dry cleaners, and enforcing some sort of pollution controls in the shipping (trucks, busses, etc.) industry. Much more f/x to be gained from any one of those, yet CARB keeps on pursuing LEV, SLEV, PNEV, blah blah blah cars when the pollution reduction is already almost nil. As far as Guzzi passing CA's smog test: MGNA is stupid. If Guzzi is still working on a 50-state bike, MGN should be selling as many 49-state bikes as possible to keep the factory open long enough to produce that 50-state machine. Besides, nobody who lives in CA & wants a Guzzi badly is going to be perturbed with having to buy it in another state & ride it long enough to have the 7501 miles on the odo to register it as a "used" vehicle when they bring it home. Heck, I'd rather spend my registration tax dollars in some state where they really do use it on the roads, rather than here where the money gets diverted into some socialist politician's pocket so he can continue his efforts at denying me my constitutional rights. And yes, if my family wasn't all here, I likely would have moved elsewhere by now. CA used to be the garden of eden; now it's just the poster child for why this nation was never intended to be a democracy. Ride on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlaing Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 snipHeck, I'd rather spend my registration tax dollars in some state where they really do use it on the roads, rather than here where the money gets diverted into some socialist politician's pocket so he can continue his efforts at denying me my constitutional rights. 62772[/snapback] Get your facts straight. It is the right wing corporate puppets that are diverting the most money, and yes some of them are right wing democrats, not socialists. Barbara Boxer is the only Senator to stand up for your coñstitutional right to have your vote counted....and she is at the "worse"(I read best) a right wing socialist. Socialism and Communism in the US have nothing to with oppressing your rights when you are not doing harm to others. There is no Stalin or Hitler on the left wing....even if they called themselves a Communist and a Socialist. They have NOTHING in common with the left, other than lip service. The biggest killers and oppressors of rights are on the right wing. The left wing is the only reason people ever fought to have rights. I hope that some of you get reincarnated into the 90 percentile of poor people in the world, so MAYBE, you could understand economics. And back to the topic before this post gets censored.... If the law has not changed, Guzzi can still sell up to 500 bikes in California per year and not have to pass the SHED test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belfastguzzi Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 It is of my opinion that air cooled pushrod [read inefficient] engines are going to quickly find it tougher and tougher to pass these kind of tests. Time for Guzzi to start working on that 4 valve water cooled lump again. Ciao, Steve G. 62751[/snapback] Although much has been made of that, apparently it is not proving to be the case and air cooled lumps are doing fine. I'll see if I can find the piece about that. Liquid cooled MG: as per other thread, it seems that it's all signed, sealed and delivered technically. Now the bikes just need to be designed. They've been promised, er, ...soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guzzirider Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Although much has been made of that, apparently it is not proving to be the case and air cooled lumps are doing fine. I'll see if I can find the piece about that. Liquid cooled MG: as per other thread, it seems that it's all signed, sealed and delivered technically. Now the bikes just need to be designed. They've been promised, er, ...soon 62779[/snapback] It's nice of Guzzi to give us at least 3 years after a launch before you can buy a new model- gives us plenty of time to save our pennies so we don't have to borrow any money to buy one when they finally arrive. Well done Guzzi! Guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AdamofKC Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 It is of my opinion that air cooled pushrod [read inefficient] engines are going to quickly find it tougher and tougher to pass these kind of tests. Time for Guzzi to start working on that 4 valve water cooled lump again. Ciao, Steve G. 62751[/snapback] It makes me wonder though how H-D gets passed all the tests. The Motor Company sells their bikes world-wide without to much of a problem complying even with the Euro2 to 3 regulations. H-D uses push-rods on their engines, no? And the same for some of the Jap-4 cruisers too? Someone correct me if I'm wrong about the push-rod stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belfastguzzi Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 While looking for the Euro3 piece, I see that the 1000 Sport is being produced at the rate of 50 per day. What would MG production rate be? –––––––––––––––––––––––found it––––––––––––––––––––––– Back to AIR-COOLED motors, proving easier to pass the latest emissions regulations. Euro 3 is "not the beginning of the end for air-cooled motors – it could be securing their place in motorcycles for some time yet" It's the fact that Euro 3 regs are measured at cold as well as fully warmed-up that makes them much tougher, but also means that air cooled motors are coping better than water-cooled. **Air-cooled engines get up to full operating temperature much faster, so although their emissions might be poorer, they are running at less efficient colder temperatures for a shorter time – and under Euro 3, this compensates. A second advantage: noise emmissions are measured at a fixed percentage of maximum rpm – so air-cooled engines are measured at a lower rpm where the volume is easier for engineers to control. The article also claims that it is this warm-up issue that is, "putting pressure on manufacturers to fit stubby, under-belly exhaust systems, so the catalytic converters can be positioned as close as possible to the exhaust valve, ensuring the fastest possible warm-up. The benefit of centralising mass is just another bonus." **You may not agree: thinking of the debate re moisture in the oil and the spine-frame condensor where there was a view that the air-cooled motor is slow to warm-up and water-cooled is faster/more controlled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeve Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Get your facts straight.It is the right wing corporate puppets that are diverting the most money, and yes some of them are right wing democrats, not socialists. Barbara Boxer is the only Senator to stand up for your coñstitutional right to have your vote counted....and she is at the "worse"(I read best) a right wing socialist. Socialism and Communism in the US have nothing to with oppressing your rights when you are not doing harm to others. There is no Stalin or Hitler on the left wing....even if they called themselves a Communist and a Socialist. They have NOTHING in common with the left, other than lip service. The biggest killers and oppressors of rights are on the right wing. The left wing is the only reason people ever fought to have rights. I hope that some of you get reincarnated into the 90 percentile of poor people in the world, so MAYBE, you could understand economics. And back to the topic before this post gets censored.... If the law has not changed, Guzzi can still sell up to 500 bikes in California per year and not have to pass the SHED test. 62776[/snapback] My facts are straight. Barbara Boxer & Diane Feinstein & the rest of the democrats who've locked up the California legislature & keep saddling us with more & more poorly written, ill-conceived & horribly implemented legal impedimenta are about as right wing as Trotsky. Buy a vowel, get a clue: whatever it takes, you need a little perspective! The fact that you want to deny the results of demagoguery throughout history & plead that the prime examples of what left wing politics produces does nothing to contradict the fact that Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Robespierre et al were & continue to stand as the shining examples of left wing political icons. The left wing as the "warriors of freedom" would make any of the real people who died fightiing for liberty in the French or American Revolutions puke. Since my degree is in economics, I think I have a better grasp of the subject than most. At least good enough that my friends won't watch the news with me anymore 'cause I start pointing out the lies, the d@mn lies & of course, the statistical fallacies used to prop up their specious arguments. Oh, & btw: I wasn't exactly born w/ a silver spoon in my mouth, buddy. The only money anyone in my family has had has come from working for it, & scrimping & saving it. Socialist don't respect that; it's against their political agenda of increasing the number of voters dependent upon the public largesse, who then reelect the socialist overlords like good little sheeple... Since CA isn't going to let anyone take advantage of the "under 500" quota w/o a fight, I don't think that MGNA is too far off the mark wanting a 50-state bike to simplify their lives. Their argument that the CA dealers are going to bail in large numbers if they can't have a 50-state bike from the outset is likely invalid, since any dealer worth their salt doesn't consider someone more than 200 miles away to be their "competition." Remember that "Do it for the children" is the battle cry of an enemy of freedom. Ride on, Your friendly neighborhood libertarian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 ..."Do it for the children" is the battle cry of an enemy of freedom.... Could you define "freedom"? KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nogbad Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 My facts are straight.Barbara Boxer & Diane Feinstein & the rest of the democrats who've locked up the California legislature & keep saddling us with more & more poorly written, ill-conceived & horribly implemented legal impedimenta are about as right wing as Trotsky. Buy a vowel, get a clue: whatever it takes, you need a little perspective! The fact that you want to deny the results of demagoguery throughout history & plead that the prime examples of what left wing politics produces does nothing to contradict the fact that Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Robespierre et al were & continue to stand as the shining examples of left wing political icons. The left wing as the "warriors of freedom" would make any of the real people who died fightiing for liberty in the French or American Revolutions puke. Since my degree is in economics, I think I have a better grasp of the subject than most. At least good enough that my friends won't watch the news with me anymore 'cause I start pointing out the lies, the d@mn lies & of course, the statistical fallacies used to prop up their specious arguments. Oh, & btw: I wasn't exactly born w/ a silver spoon in my mouth, buddy. The only money anyone in my family has had has come from working for it, & scrimping & saving it. Socialist don't respect that; it's against their political agenda of increasing the number of voters dependent upon the public largesse, who then reelect the socialist overlords like good little sheeple... Since CA isn't going to let anyone take advantage of the "under 500" quota w/o a fight, I don't think that MGNA is too far off the mark wanting a 50-state bike to simplify their lives. Their argument that the CA dealers are going to bail in large numbers if they can't have a 50-state bike from the outset is likely invalid, since any dealer worth their salt doesn't consider someone more than 200 miles away to be their "competition." Remember that "Do it for the children" is the battle cry of an enemy of freedom. Ride on, Your friendly neighborhood libertarian 62797[/snapback] Well said Skeeve my man! Hey those SHEDs look awesome. I wonder if I could afford the one with the dyno for my back garden.......? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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