Griso Presentation!

[pete roper]

Bars are an easy change though. I wonder how effective the screen will be.

60614[/snapback]

 

Duh! One thing I was thinking it would need, (For a fat old fart like me who reckons being hung out in the wind has whiskers on it!) would be some sort of screen, or better still a cockpit fairing of some sort. Is the factory planning on offering such things? Not that it's an issue, Givi make a universal cockpit fairing, (A mate has one on his Mk IV LeMans.) that would probably do the business. Just call me old fashioned but i tend to think it's a bit daggy to simply buy all your bits from the aftermarket catalog, it reeks of HD style desperation and lack of imagination to me.

 

Bars? Well, if they are 7/8th bars then it will be easy. If they decide to use fatties then I can see it being a bit more of a chore but not insurmountable. Something a bit lower would definitely be on my shopping list.

 

Pete

[pete roper]

Although Guzzi engineers have not touched the internal power producing parts of the engine, the new air box and exhaust system do liberate a couple more horses and a few more lb./ft. of torque which is nice.

60484[/snapback]

 

 

This is actually inaccurate and shows the bloke hasn't done his homework very well. The Motor used in the Breva and the Griso does have substantiakl changes over the one used in the V11 and 1100 CAli variants which actually quite surprised me, miserable old cynic that I am

 

The most important thing is that the rod/stroke ratio has been changed. The new motor uses substantially longer rods which will help reduce vibration and other power robbing effects as well as reducing the stresses on the rods themselves and sidethrust on the pistons. The extra length has been coped with by reducing the deck height of the pistons and le reduced side thrust has allowed the use of shorter skirts on the slugs as well. So although the motor is externally dimensionally the same the actual rumpy-pumpy bits inside have changed somewhat.

 

For people who have built revvier Guzzi big blocks in the past one the easiest options was to use the earlier 70mm crank rather than the 78mm item and getting longer rods made by Carillo or someone. Although in terms of outright power the top tuners like Amadeo Castellani found that both short stroke and long stroke motors produced much the same the added torque of the longer stroke crank was more usefull on the track than the over-rev capabillity of the short stroker. With the new configuration one can have the best of both worlds and in a road motor this should be a splendid thing! My one concern really remains the question of whether it will be possible to cam the buggers up a bit? With the 1100 motors the rod big ends pass very, very close to the cam lobes, even with the standard cam, (Very similar to the P3/SS of old.) Going to something with especially more lift may make for bits biffing into each other, such are the limitations of the old block!

 

To my eye though the changes wrought seem like good ones. My assumption is that the twin spark heads have simultaneous firing. staggering the sparks could also pay small dividends but we're talking 'Final Option' type tuning here, even so, it has the potential for fun. I love the fact they've gone for lower gearing! Sorry, but I really don't need a machine that can do over 120mph, in fact I don't really need one that can exceed the 'Ton' by much, having something that goes like a cut cat up to 100mph is far more important to me than theoretical top speeds that rival the space shuttle. If I want to go faster than that I can get in something with 'Boeing' written on the side .

 

Pete

[belfastguzzi]

One thing I was thinking it would need, (For a fat old fart like me who reckons being hung out in the wind has whiskers on it!) would be some sort of screen, or better still a cockpit fairing of some sort...Just call me old fashioned Pete

60636[/snapback]

 

knock up a side car

pack a basket of sarnies and nice rug

climb in

get a young whippersnapper* to drive the two-wheeled bit

– happy as Larry

 

 

 

 

* ah, so that's what you meant when you said you wanted to 'get Cliff on board'

[belfastguzzi]

OK, so...slut the donk up a bit... it could be fun...

Pete

60419[/snapback]

 

Ropey gets his yella Greaso, bonks the donk, biffs the bink, T3s the pushrods and generally does the 'Final Tuning Option'

 

then hits the Aussie dunes for some old-fashioned fun

[Skeeve]

...

The most important thing is that the rod/stroke ratio has been changed. The new motor uses substantially longer rods which will help reduce vibration and other power robbing effects as well as reducing the stresses on the rods themselves and sidethrust on the pistons. The extra length has been coped with by reducing the deck height of the pistons and le reduced side thrust has allowed the use of shorter skirts on the slugs as well. So although  the motor is externally dimensionally the same the actual rumpy-pumpy bits inside have changed somewhat.

...

Pete

60641[/snapback]

 

So, Pete:

 

Will the longer rods/shorter pistons be a drop-in fit for someone who's already got his V11 motor torn down that far, or are the parts changes to the new motor too subtle for that sort of brute-force approach to an upgrade?

 

I'm also wondering if the mapping for the new bikes is different, ie: w/ dual plugs, the spark advance should have been backed way off. Or did Guzzi fumble that part of the equation again, & that's why the new Quotards are making less power than the V11 series?

[steffen]

Although Guzzi engineers have not touched the internal power producing parts of the engine, the new air box and exhaust system do liberate a couple more horses and a few more lb./ft. of torque which is nice.

 

This is actually inaccurate and shows the bloke hasn't done his homework very well. The Motor used in the Breva and the Griso does have substantiakl changes over the one used in the V11 and 1100 CAli variants which actually quite surprised me, miserable old cynic that I am

 

 

Uhm, my first post, and I have to correct Pete Roper of all people. But what the bloke actually means is, that the engine in the breva and the griso is the same. He has made a write-up on the Breva where he goes through some of the engine-changes:

 

http://www.motorcycle.com/mo/mcyossef/05_Breva/index.motml

 

and he actually knows guzzi, how well is for others to decide, but here is an old story, where he states that:

 

As the owner of several Gootsies in diverse states of decay/restoration, it's hard for me to be impartial about the Moto-Guzzi V11 Sport "Scura" and to treat it objectively as if it was just another cycle. But what really turns me into an unsuitable candidate to test ride the V11 is totally unrelated to my intimate knowledge of the tiny needle rollers that sit inside a Guzzi's CV joint and the type of grease they like for breakfast.

 

http://www.motorcycle.com/mo/mcyossef/02v11_scura.motml

 

By the way I love the Griso, but it seems, that in Denmark it will cost around

38.000 US-dollars. I'll have to dream on for a little while.

 

regards.

Steffen, Denmark

[pete roper]

Uhm, my first post, and I have to correct Pete Roper of all people. But what the bloke actually means is, that the engine in the breva and the griso is the same. He has made a write-up on the Breva where he goes through some of the engine-changes:

Steffen, Denmark

60675[/snapback]

 

On re-reading I see you are absolutely correct. A misunderstanding on my part fostered by my inate distrust of Journalists who should all be rounded up into football stadiums and shot.

 

Pete (Who also understands that most people feel that way about motorbike mechanics )

[steffen]

On re-reading I see you are absolutely correct. A misunderstanding on my part fostered by my inate distrust of Journalists who should all be rounded up into football stadiums and shot.

 

Pete (Who also understands that most people feel that way about motorbike mechanics     )

60680[/snapback]

 

Makes sense. I'm a journalist

 

Steffen

[callison]

By the way I love the Griso, but it seems, that in Denmark it will cost around

38.000 US-dollars. I'll have to dream on for a little while.

 

regards.

Steffen, Denmark

60675[/snapback]

 

Steffen, what part of Denmark? I love Denmark, great people, pretty countrysides, horrible taxes. Now you've posted the price of the Griso there, I'm appalled. Taxes there were high when I was at at Skrydstrup in 1986 , but they must have gone even higher since then. That sounds like a VAT of about 150%.

[gthyni]

Denmark has an extra tax on new motor vehicles,

but Steffen, you could alway buy it Sweden, lend it

to me for 6 months and 5000 km and then bring it to

Denmark as secondhand/used bike.

Always ready to help even if it is hard work

[steffen]

Denmark has an extra tax on new motor vehicles,

but Steffen, you could alway buy it Sweden, lend it

to me for 6 months and 5000 km and then bring it to

Denmark as secondhand/used bike.

Always ready to help even if it is hard work

60693[/snapback]

 

Actually the tax on new motorbikes and cars is approx 180 pct, without the tax we have the cheapest vehicles in europe. Ain't much comfort in that, though.

yeah, you swedes are lucky with your cheap cars and bikes. Thanks for the offer, I'll consider it. But even second hand won't help you, because when you import it, you'll have to pay taxes corresponding to the value in denmark.

But I'm angry because the danish aprilia and guzzi-importer has made the Griso much more expensive than the Breva. Arrrgh...

[Guest Nogbad]

Actually the tax on new motorbikes and cars is approx 180 pct, without the tax we have the cheapest vehicles in europe. Ain't much comfort in that, though.

yeah, you swedes are lucky with your cheap cars and bikes. Thanks for the offer, I'll consider it. But even second hand won't help you, because when you import it, you'll have to pay taxes corresponding to the value in denmark.

But I'm angry because the danish aprilia and guzzi-importer has made the Griso much more expensive than the Breva. Arrrgh...

60713[/snapback]

 

What happened to the single European market??

[steffen]

What happened to the single European market??

60714[/snapback]

 

we have a single market allright, but not for taxes and wellfare.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack the thread, but the taxes on cars and motorbikes really is depressing... Now back to discussing the Griso...

 

I forgot to add: I appreciate Carl Allisons fond memories of Denmark. We like to think of our selves as...

I live in copenhagen, ain't much contryside here...

[gthyni]

Steffen you have to move over the bridge then,

my cousin is living in Malmö and working in Köpenhamn.

 

The single market is not for us, it's for big business.

When it is beneficial to them we have free trade,

when they prefer control over a local market we have

strange taxation to stop free trade.

[badmotogoozer]

Wow - just like the Free Trade agreement between Canada and the US... Good to know somebody else is taking it in the hoop too...

 

Rj