Paul Minnaert Posted October 18, 2004 Author Share Posted October 18, 2004 that's sure, I have a nice see-through picture here. ALso the thing is pitured on the picture from the new clutch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Reader Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 Paul- Don't know if the clutch was worked on before i owned the Scura. It was owned by someone from the previous Australian Guzzi importer. The bike had 4500 kms on it when i bought it. I'll see if i can find out. The Ram unit that is in the bike now went from quiet to noisy after 500 kms. This clutch/flywheel feels lighter than the previous. Steve from Moto One states that the unit now on my bike weighs 1.4 kg whereas the old unit come in at 4kg. Let us hope the extra weight wasn't saved around the bolt holes. I wasn't able to directly compare the two units as Moto One is out of these Ram kits. I'm no engineer but the broken flywheel looks like it could retain more "meat" around the central area. Leafman- My bikes clutch performed perfectly from day one with a similair riding style that you mentioned then it munted itself with very little warning at 22500 kms. I'd enjoy your riding while being wary ! Pete- looking at the bolt holes. Doesnt appear as if anything other than flat surface contact was made around the holes- nil gouges etc. Have a look and see what you think. Regards Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sws626 Posted October 26, 2004 Share Posted October 26, 2004 Does anyone have the link to the German V11 site handy. I speak German and would be happy to report back on the general tone of discussion there on this topic. As an owner a 2002 Scura, I find these reports very disturbing. Stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted October 26, 2004 Author Share Posted October 26, 2004 Stuart, which site are you refering too? There is a german v11sport forum, and a general guzzi forum. Both didn't talk about it for some time. v11sport: http://35229.rapidforum.com/ general forum: http://forum.world-of-guzzi.de/ you could have found these in the links section , on top of this page. :-) I met the owner of one the scura's with an exploded clutch, he is lucky to still have his legs. He has a beemer now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrt Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 So, I was riding and thinking last night and came up with a theory. The assumption: All the exploding clutches are Scura's from a reasonably similar manufacture time. The hypothesis: Could it be that the engines were not well balanced, and vibrations transmitted to the clutch stressed the aluminum to the breaking point? The RAM clutches are balanced from the factory. The Guzzi engines are not necessarily, though they tend to be close. Anyone with an explosive clutch care to comment? Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sws626 Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 Thanks Paul. I had a look through and saw pretty much the same hypotheses and concerns as have been expressed in this forum. Stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tikkanen Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 So, I was riding and thinking last night and came up with a theory.The assumption: All the exploding clutches are Scura's from a reasonably similar manufacture time. The hypothesis: Could it be that the engines were not well balanced, and vibrations transmitted to the clutch stressed the aluminum to the breaking point? The RAM clutches are balanced from the factory. The Guzzi engines are not necessarily, though they tend to be close. Anyone with an explosive clutch care to comment? Jason 36126[/snapback] Sounds reasonable, Jason and I dare to say, that your hypothesis is right. The questions is, why don't MG take this general complaint seriously? It's a world wide phenomenon - it's not just happening in i.e. Germany, Sweden or the US. They can't just play deaf, dumb and blind - they have to face the music now! As a Scura owner myself I have this feeling that one day (not some day) my clutch will go South, too. How about a consolidated complain from this forum? United we stand, together we fall........ Søren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Minnaert Posted October 29, 2004 Author Share Posted October 29, 2004 Jason, nice theory, but doens't explain why there is no rosso mandello or tenni clutch broken, as far as we know. But until now there are 6 broken, from which 3 were claimed at the factory, So for them it's not a problem like the hydraulic valve issue. Until someone has an accident from the results. I know when I just had the daytona , someone in germany had an accident, I got a cage around the end of the drive shaft. That has stayed there, so the v11 inherrited it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete roper Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Well, Bruce's clutch and flywheel arrived yesterday and I just got a chance to pull 'em out and have a look. To be honest I think the issue is that the alloy basket is simply too bloody thin! Compared to one of the anodised Alloy wheels that are available for the (Less powerful.) earlier models the thickness of the RAM/Guzzi part is a lot less. The last *real* RAM unit I installed was on an 1100 Sport C and from memory the whole unit looked substantially different and I certainly don't remember the back of the wheel being quite so skinny? Do you want me to take some pics so someone can post 'em up here???? Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tikkanen Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Hi Pete, Yes please! I'm hanging up my wheels soon, and I would love to have some "evidence" when I face my dealer. My clutch is still working fine, but the sound.... He keeps telling: "Well, you haven't the Ducati's" but I think that's a lot of bull. Thanks for all the tech tips you provide Søren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete roper Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 I had a bit of a closer look at the whole wretched pile of sh!t while I was working on my own bike today, (Bloody SP, It's only done 89,000Km's and the clutch had started to get touchy. I went in to give it a wash and the next thing I know it's two and a bit hours later and I'm holding the rear main bearing in my hand thinking, "Why did I take that out? The seal nly looked a *little* wet?" ) and while obviously the flywheel is 'Donald Ducked' what caught my eye was the fact that the clutch boss was incredibly worn, as were the friction plate splines. I'll take pics but there is at least 1.5mm of free play betwixt the boss splines and the plate splines and this to me indicates that the idle speed was way too low. Whether the idle speed was set ower than the manufacturers recommendations who knows but I'd certainly suggest that with this light a clutch assembley that you should get it up a bit. With my little hot-rod which a;so has bugger-all flywheel and is in a fairly high state of tune I have the idle, (For a variety of reasons.) at between 1,300 and 1,500. With a motor with high comression ratio and a cam designed for more top end the power pulses at very low RPM are going to be harsh and irregular. The lack of a heavy flywheel to even out the pulses by storing and releasing energy over the whole 720 degree cycle is going to exacerbate these problems so to my mind, get that idle speed up and DON'T sit at the lights with the clutch in, (I've been telling Guzzi owners this for years and still I see buggered clutch bosses and flywheels. The small spline boss in my hot-rod is the same one that it left the factory with in 1979, it's done nearly 300,000miles and while less than perfect it's still serviceable. I'm not a bloody magician but I do set my idle high and don't sit at the lights with the clutch in, so..... ) Just to prove to you that I am *really* perverse I'll tell you that the real reason I took the gearbox off the SP was to fit an Ambo flywheel. You know. The one that weighs about as much as a complete V11 . Why? Because for a fast, point to point tourer a VAST flywheel is GREAT!!!! At the same time it's getting LeMAns mid-valve heads, 88mm barrels and pistons to suit and a cosmetic freshen up to ensure it's devine ugliness is around for another 30 years Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrt Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 get that idle speed up and DON'T sit at the lights with the clutch in, (I've been telling Guzzi owners this for years 36335[/snapback] This was the first piece of advice the mechanic gave me when I bought my first Guzzi in '82. J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 ...don't sit at the lights with the clutch in... Do you mean by "clutch in" - clutch disengaged? ie in gear with clutch lever pulled in? KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete roper Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 Yup, that's the one. The higher the state of tune and especially compression the greater the acceleration and deceleration of the crank, (And therefore flywheel.) so if the clutch is pulled in the friction plate/s rattle around and flog f@ck out of the boss. KB, you'll love this, I just stuck an Ambo flywheel in my SP, it's bigger than Ben Hur and rides B-e-a-t-i-f-u-l-l-Y. It's like a Burrel Road Locomotive! Brilliant!!!! Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldini Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 Ambo flywheel in my SP, it's bigger than Ben Hur and rides B-e-a-t-i-f-u-l-l-Y. It's like a Burrel Road Locomotive! Brilliant!!!! Pete, I like the heavy flywheel - esp for distances, nowadays my riding is mostly short blasts with the odd trackday so the lighter wheels suit. But I do miss that sitting on a locomotive feel - one day will make another heavy flywheel bike . Roberto - Was the aftermarket RAM same thickness flywheel as came out. Anyone else able to compare thickness of original Scura unit w/ RAM unit available for V11's? KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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