Search the Community

Chain drive? I think this is a rebadged Benelli. Cool restoration

You're right about that assembly dampening driveline shocks. The standard cush drive in the wheel is too stiff to completely do this by itself.

I'd say "don't disassemble the wheel & cush assembly" The tire can be changed as it is. Also don't lose the bush that goes on the axle between the wheel and the bevel box. It's needed to get bearing preloads right. If you're like me and can't help pulling it apart, then the following pictures may help. The retaining plate screws are likely to be frozen. Heat and penetrating oil are your friends. How hot, you ask? Well the rear disk can be red hot without other damage, but 60°C would be safe. Then you can lift the splined plate out.

When I needed a replacement rear drive, I got one from Italy. It was in good order, except for freeplay that I thought was too high, been that way from new. The workshop manual did not help me, it is sparse and seems to apply to earlier models. I made pinion and crown wheel shims, then made tools (a bit crude) to allow measurements. After 14 tries, I eventually got both preload and freeplay low enough to be happy with. A slow and tedious process. Contact impression interpretation is a black art, with vague contact marks that need a strong light and a good imagination. You will never get it perfect on a worn C&W set. The bevel box is now quiet and runs cool. However, if your box is ok, then the only maintenance needed is oil change and spline grease.

Drilling the cush rubbers was Greg Field's idea. I tried it, and never went back. Making a Cushier Cush Drive - Technical Topics - Moto Guzzi V11LeMans.com Forum There are 3 places that need lubrication while you have the drive plate off. The input spline to the wheel benefits from Kluber Staburags NBU 30 PTM grease, the rubber pucks and retainer plate spacer benefit from dry-lube spray, and the drive plate bore needs waterproof grease. Should I lubricate my rubbers? - Technical Topics - Moto Guzzi V11LeMans.com Forum More discussion here: Cush drive lubrication - Technical Topics - Moto Guzzi V11LeMans.com Forum

When I first saw a Guzzi, I liked it's design. Two cylinders angled out into the airstream. Equal cooling on the hot side of each cylinder head. No shared cyl wall like many twins, no rear cyl running hotter like HD & Ducati. Like a BMW twin, but cooler looking, with more ground clearance. Shaft drive. Less mess and less maintenance (or so I thought then). Dry clutch. Oil on a friction surface just seems wrong to me, and oil for engines and gearboxes should be different. Those features are no longer so important in modern bikes, but I still love the character and soul of the bike. It feels alive. I took a Triumph Bonneville for a blast, and nearly died of boredom (unlike the Thruxton R). I don't feel that way on a V11. Also I like how there are not many on the road.

I had these symptoms on my '03, after the bike sitting unused for too long with the rear drive out. I replaced the 5 pin relay in the forward position, and now all good. This time I binned the relay, instead of putting it in with all the spares of doubtful function in the monkey paw trap.

A picture of the O-ring, so as Docc said, part of the "cush drive". This picture shows the standard V11 configuration, with all 12 undrilled rubber pucks

Rob (O2V11) called me and offered to drive to Dunedin from Edendale with spare parts if you needed anything, as his bike is waiting for a crankcase vent hose. Kind offer, but I think the part you need is a single use terminal. I hope I'm right.

I lubed my rubber bits. I sprayed the cush rubbers and the pockets with molybdenum disulfide dry lube spray. Greg Field wrote about a good idea you can do to the cush rubbers here: https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/11820-making-a-cushier-cush-drive/&tab=comments#comment-125587 I think this link might be interesting too: https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/20331-cush-drive-lubrication/&tab=comments#comment-230956 For the spline to the wheel, you might think about Kluber Staburags NBU 30 PTM. BMW part #. 07559062476. Expensive but good.

Hello Blight, My bike is exactly the same as your video. It is bad enough that riding slowly in first gear is uncomfortably jerky. All the backlash is between the output splines of the bevel box and the rear wheel. I thought the same as you, that the bevel box was failing, but no. You could check that backlash again with the rear wheel off to see if yours is the same.. See also https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=20324 I tried installing the rear wheel after applying mould release spray and aluminised epoxy to the spline. After the epoxy cured, I greased the spline, refitted the wheel, and rode the bike. Much better, but a very temporary solution. It proved to me that the only fix is to replace the cush drive spline plate, and the crown wheel & pinion set. Expensive. Actually I bought a spline plate from Moto International (before they closed) and a 2nd hand low km bevel box from eBay Italy. How will I slow the spline from wearing again? Use a good layer of spline grease like Staburags NBU 30 PTM on it. I have already drilled the cush drive rubbers, and removed half the rubber pucks, to make the drive cushier. That is an idea from the Guzzi expert Greg Field, and I think it will prolong the life of all the splines from the clutch all the way back.

Jason, I put a computer hard drive magnet on the oil filter of my Toyota Hilux pickup. It stayed in place till the next oil change, when I opened the filter can to look. I could see the outline of the magnet on the inside of the filter can. Just a dark outline that disappeared as soon as I touched it. So the magnet was collecting steel particles from the oil, but I don't know if it has any real world benefit. It certainly can't do any harm on an external filter, but I'd be reluctant to put one inside the sump of my bike.

I used Sandstrom Lubricant, Solid Film, MIL-PRF-46147. Molycote 321 is just as good. But since anything is better than nothing, whatever molybdenum disulfide spray you can find in your local hardware store will be ok. Probably better actually, as the Sandstrom stuff I used should be cured at 60°C, (150°F), and I didn't bother. BTW, I got this idea of drilling the cush rubbers from Greg Field, who knows stuff about Guzzis. As Scud mentioned, Greg posted here: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=11820 I agree with him that the V11 is improved, and the drive train should last longer, with a cushier cush drive. But I don't share his view that engine braking causes damage to the wheel drive spline. I think that each 530cc piston slamming torque down the drive train every engine rev is the main reason for spline wear.

The hub definitely needs to be greased. If the splined drive plate seizes from rust, then the cush drive cannot cushion any more. You can see grease distribution grooves inside the spline drive plate bore, so we know the designer thought this is important. Of course some grease will get in there anyway if you are generous with grease in the drive spline. On my bike, I sprayed the rubber pucks and puck pockets with a thin layer of dry lube, and also on the large diameter spacer. The wheel stays clean, and the plate can still move in the wheel. I drilled the rubber pucks with lots of little holes, and only refitted half of the pairs of pucks so the cush drive would be "cushier". Also, an odd effect of rubber is that it does not compress much. If you squeeze in one place, it will bulge out in another place, without the volume changing (Poisson's Ratio for rubber is 0.5). This tells me that the pucks will be cushier if they could squirm in in their pockets easily, so dry lube helps. So to summarise, my bike rear wheel has: 1. Half the pucks drilled, half discarded. (optional choice for you) 2. Dry lube on pucks, puck pockets, large spacer. (optional) 3. Grease in bore of drive plate. (must do)

I think that some grease on that spline is really important. So important that a little cleaning job is better than not having enough grease in there. I have to fit a new cush drive plate, and a near new bevel box to my bike this coming winter. The spline teeth in the crown wheel spline, and drive plate are 1/3 worn away, probably because of lack of lubrication in the bike's 80,000 km before I got it. Backlash makes the bike uncomfortable to ride really slowly in first gear. I bought the bike cheaper because of this spline wear, and I'm finally going to fix it. I have been greasing that spline with Penrite wheel bearing grease, and think a little too much grease is better than too little on that spline. Cleaning is easier than replacing worn parts.

There are pictures of a bevel box in bits here: https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/15908-rear-drive-seal/&do=findComment&comment=231729

While you wait for Pete, you could download the workshop manual and parts catalogue for your bike. They both have a section about the rear drive. http://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_misc.html Then you could look at some previous posts: https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/20168-rear-bevel-box/ https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/20765-rear-bearings-and-brake/&do=findComment&comment=240105 https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/19797-ring-pinion-gears/ https://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?/topic/15908-rear-drive-seal/

I agree, Staburags grease would be great for the spline couplings at each end of the driveshaft. It would squeeze out to allow the splines to clamp together tightly, but still exclude air & water, to reduce fretting corrosion. Drylube in that joint could crush away to allow the spline clamping to loosen, and rapid wear might be next. The spline in the middle of the driveshaft needs regular thin grease, as it slides a lot, and clearances are too tight for a layer of dry lube. The spline from the bevel box to the cush drive can benefit from both dry lube on all contact faces, and when cured, Staburags or similar HT moly grease. It is not a tight spline, so a buildup of drylube is a good thing. My bike is very worn there so lube can only delay the inevitable parts replacements. But still it is plastered with drylube, including the cush drive parts & rubbers, then the spline is greased. CRC Dry Moly is probably fine, especially for your rear wheel cush drive spline, since you can reapply at every tire change. I don't know how durable it is longer term in the clutch, which is harder to access, but still anything is better than nothing. When I get to the clutch on my bike, I will drylube the clutch parts just as Tim described.

Never mind, I saw the red seat with Öhlins and got excited... Yes, it looks a bit like a Scura R, but has Marzocchi forks. That red seat is kangaroo hide. The owner is an upholsterer, and he made an excellent job of covering the seat. It looks great. Which bike is that? Can you copy/paste an image? Sorry Docc, I couldn't find a way to paste the pics, but links are below instead. Maybe Jaap's new security settings changed pasting? https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxnfKnNo4vVwMjFsYlJmS0FHVjg/view?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxnfKnNo4vVwR2V3cWlSemQ2b1E/view?usp=sharing

About 70 people showed up for the 24th Tattley Rappet 2017 Moto Guzzi rally. There was a few V11s, some newer Guzzis, and a lot of older Guzzis. I set off for the first meeting on Friday evening, stalled on the way, and no restart! Relay failure! Just as well I had five spares stashed in the monkey paw trap. (Thanks Docc). We went over the hill to Akaroa on a Poker Run on Saturday, and we went to Kaikoura on Sunday. I got passed several times on the twisties by guys on round barrel Le Mans bikes. Even a scruffy Convert with a 1000 LeMans engine was no slouch. Those things are awesome, or is it the riders? Some of us went north past Kaikoura, on as far as the road is still open. It was closed by slips after a quake a year ago, but should be open again by the end of the year. On the way home I stopped at Parnassus to get fuel. It was an unattended fuel stop, but it took ages to get fuel. 15 minutes talking to a local guy, then fuelled up, then there was another quake, or was it an aftershock? (5.8 is enough to get your attention). There was a cop with a radar just down the road, and he drove up to me and he said "didja feel that? I'm not staying parked under those power lines with that kind of carry on". He was a motorbike cop in Christchurch in his early years, but he was polite enough not to say anything about my bike. So that took another 15 minutes swapping stories with him before I got going again. Good weather, great people, excellent weekend. Apparently the next Tattley Rappet will be in Palmerston North in 2018. Pictures of bikes here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BxnfKnNo4vVwWmZkNkNaam5Pdmc?usp=sharing Look out for the little Stornello there. The owner just finished restoring it, and rode furtherest to get to the rally. If the pictures don't open for you, please PM me and I'll try posting another way.

As Scud says, there is an escape hole in the grease cavity on every driveshaft. Normally the drive shaft length extends and compresses a little during suspension travel. This is the reason that the sliding spline exists, and it needs lubrication. I can think of two reasons why you need that little hole. 1. If the grease cavity was full of grease without an escape path, then it is possible to get a "hydraulic lock", which would make something bend or break at the next bump on the road. (at a guess, I'd say the gearbox top mount). 2. Grease is mostly oil mixed with a thickener, so as the oil seeps away, the remaining thickener needs to be flushed away by fresh grease. That little hole allows that flushing to happen.

As Docc says, it looks like you have field magnets unglued and jamming the armature. That drive cog is throwing forward as it should, but it should also spin. Normally with no load, it should spin up so fast the armature commutator (where the brushes touch) can destroy itself, so only do that check momentarily. With the armature jammed, the current goes off the charts high, and cooks things inside. Again, momentary contact is enough to test it. Here is a link which deals with the magnet problem: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19296 And here is Cash1000's experience: http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19676

That flywheel looks like a work of art alright, but I worry that you may be disappointed if you fit it. Aluminum is not durable as a flywheel material. It would be great for racing, where frequent inspections and rebuilds occur, but it cannot last as long as a steel part. There are some reasons why aluminum is not used in most flywheel designs. Aluminium is weaker than steel and softer than cast iron. There are some very strong aluminum alloys, but these are susceptible to corrosion and stress corrosion cracking, so need surface protection and frequent inspection. Alum does not have a fatigue limit like steel, so it will eventually crack from the constant load reversals from the engine compression/power strokes from those two cylinders. The surface of alum can be made hard enough for wear resistance in the contact faces of the clutch rotor teeth by hard anodising, but still wear in those teeth will exceed that of the factory flywheel. The inertia is important too. An alum flywheel has less rotational inertia, unless the manufacturer does something clever with a thicker rim. If there is less inertia, then the torsional vibrations through the drive train will be greater (worse for your gear backlash). I don't want to be a downer, but you should be aware of these things before spending money on an aftermarket product. The factory flywheel & clutch is a well optimised design, if you ride on the street, and value durability, tractability, and cost.

I've seen oil inside the bellhousing caused by tiny cracks and splits in the crankcase ventilation hose which runs from the top of the bellhousing to the frame. A new hose fixed that leak. I've had oil on my rear drive from a bad job I did replacing the valve cover gasket. Oil was also on the pork chop and my foot. I've not see a bevel box leak unless it is removed and laid on it's side. I read somewhere on this forum of a crack in the gearbox housing causing an oil leak near the gearbox mount. Have you tried sniffing the leaking oil at the three locations? Engine oil smells different from gbox & rear drive oil.

Four and a half days on the road is hard to beat Mark. I had it easy for my bike. Drive to Christchurch airport (10 minutes as the light was red), catch a plane to Palmerston North (one hour ten), meet the seller who rode to PalmerstonN from Wanganui, (one hour), then leave the bike at the local Honda dealer (one hour), fly back to Christchurch (one hour ten), drive home (8 min cause the light was green) . Then waited three days for the transporter to deliver it to Christchurch. It didn't start right away, probably pissed about sharing a truck with a Harley. Then I had two attempts to get a box of muffins delivered to the Honda dealer. There is more than one motorcycle dealer in Palmerston North apparently. So it took 4 days to get the bike, but it was much less effort than your epic trip.