MotoGP

[audiomick]

1 hour ago, Lucky Phil said:

...It used to be 80% rider and 20% bike now it's the other way around....

Which isn't to say that Joe Bloggs could get on one of those bikes and be nearly as fast as the professional riders.

It's the money, though. The more money in the sport, the more gets invested in the machinery. Some teams have more money, which generally means that their machinery is better. I have no clues what could be done to prevent that.

[Lucky Phil]

20 minutes ago, audiomick said:

Which isn't to say that Joe Bloggs could get on one of those bikes and be nearly as fast as the professional riders.

It's the money, though. The more money in the sport, the more gets invested in the machinery. Some teams have more money, which generally means that their machinery is better. I have no clues what could be done to prevent that.

It's simple Mick, tighter technical rules. Currently the racing in WSBK is at least as good as Motogp if not better and the lap times of a WSBK is around 2-3 seconds a lap slower. So you could ditch the aero and the suspension ride height BS and not only be faster than a WSBK bike but the racing would be better without the front tyre temp rubbish and the affect aero has on overtaking. Pretty easy really.

Phil

Edited May 1 by Lucky Phil

[GuzziMoto]

It is also the tires. Both MotoGP and WSBK use a single brand spec tire. WSBK uses Pirelli and MotoGP uses Michelin. THe Pirelli's in WSBK seem to suit a wider range of bike designs. While a number of bike designs struggle with the Michelins in MotoGP. KTM has issues with the rear Michelin chattering bad. Aprilia also have issues at some tracks getting the Michelin tires to work right. Whereas Ducati seem to have the best handle on the Michelin tires. So they have an advantage. When KTM had the tires figured out a while back, Michelin changed the tires and KTM was struggling again. Other brands also tend to struggle with getting the spec tires to work. I get that part of racing would be getting the tires to work, but it seems much harder to get the Michelins to work in MotoGP then it is getting the Pirellis to work in WSBK. And then you have the goal post being moved, Michelin brining out a new tire construction and / or compound.

Ditching the aero should be done, but so far they have no plans to do so, only to reduce / limit the aero. It is in the plans to get rid of the ride height adjustment, that will help. But they should be getting rid of the aero. They are also going from 1000's to 850's, that may help but odds are it will hurt more then help. When they ran 850's before it put more emphasis on cornering speed, so the racing was more processional. If you tried to pass someone you gave up your momentum and they just went back by. So instead you followed, hoping they made a mistake. And the end result was speeds were as high down the straights but higher in the corners, where they tend to crash. So the danger wasn't reduced by the smaller engines, which was supposed to be the point. Odds are at least one brand will get the smaller displacement combo right and the others will once again have to catch up, as happened last time they switched to smaller displacement. And the limits on testing slow down catching up. Currently Yamaha and Honda have help there, they get extra testing and the ability to change things like engines. But Aprilia and KTM don't have those concessions. They are struggling to catch up that last bit to Ducati.

Moving to a spec ECU with limited traction control was a great step towards equalizing the racing. The one team that missed that was Yamaha, who didn't hire Weber/Marelli people to help them work out how to use the limited capability of the spec ECU. So even today Yamaha struggle with getting the power down. It makes it look like Yamaha are way down on power, and they are down on power. But they also struggle to put what power they do have down. Their only ace in the hole is Fabio is really good at making the most of the Yamaha and what it does do well. But their issue isn't just needing more power, they also need to be able to put that power to the pavement. Honda also lack power, and they also lack traction. But their traction issues seems to be more an issue with mechanical grip, not their traction control. As with most complex equations, there is usually more then one factor in why any team / bike is slow. Adding more power without the ability to use that power may actually make you slower.

[p6x]

This weekend we have the Le Mans race!

it should be an interesting race; well, hopefully it will be. The is racetrack is the one with the most braking, 35% of the time, according to Brembo. Ducati should not be getting too much of an advantage, maybe.

It is said that Fabio Quartararo and Alex Rins will race with a new inline 4.

The French GP broke the racetrack attendance record the last two years, and they are hopeful to beat 297,471 this year.

Meanwhile, have a little taste, back in 1988 when the French GP was taking place on the Paul Ricard racetrack, on 2 strokes bikes, and with Barry Sheene commenting with a bit of an Australian accent... lol...

 

Edited Wednesday at 03:47 PM by p6x

[audiomick]

2 hours ago, p6x said:

...back in 1988 when the French GP was taking place on the Paul Ricard ...

..with Barry Sheene commenting with a bit of an Australian accent...

That brings back memories. The other bloke, with a lot of Australian accent, is Darrell Eastlake

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darrell_Eastlake

 

Listening to those two whilst watching the bike races was a compulsory event.

[gstallons]

Is that a good thing or a bad thing ? 

[audiomick]

1 hour ago, gstallons said:

Is that a good thing or a bad thing ? 

What, the memories, or the compulsory event?

Those were good times all round.

And Darrell Eastlake was a bit of an idiot. Thank god Barry was the other commentator.

[p6x]

If you want to watch an epic MotoGP, one for the books, then watch the replay of the French GP today!

I do not want to spoil it;

however, the attendance record was smashed for the first time since the number of spectators was divulged. They blew through the 300k ceiling of last year, which was already the record attendance, for all GPs.

But today's race will remain in history for multiple reasons. I leave you to watch it...

[GuzziMoto]

14 hours ago, p6x said:

If you want to watch an epic MotoGP, one for the books, then watch the replay of the French GP today!

I do not want to spoil it;

however, the attendance record was smashed for the first time since the number of spectators was divulged. They blew through the 300k ceiling of last year, which was already the record attendance, for all GPs.

But today's race will remain in history for multiple reasons. I leave you to watch it...

While it might be considered historic, I am not sure that would be because it was a great race. It was entertaining, but I have seen a lot of better races.

It was also a big warning shot to Ducati. While the race wasn't a complete disaster for them it was a clear warning that they are going down a dead end path. They appear to be making the same mistake Honda made and they had made back in the Stoner days. Making a bike that only one person can tame and go fast on. The 2025 Ducati is clearly slower then the 2024 Ducati for anyone not named Marc Marquez. All those years gaining front end feel has been lost faster then I thought they could. I figured this was going to happen, but I did not think they would go this far in one year with Marc.

As to crowd size, that is a big turnout. And the new rules about leaving the grid and / or swapping bikes / tires came into play. And while things did work smoothly I think it was clear that a double long lap penalty for the various options was not right. If you followed the rules and swapped bikes / tires after the race started you would have to pull down pitlane during the race. Where as people who took the penalty for leaving the grid or pulled into pitlane before the race started only had to do a double long lap penalty. Pulling down pitlane to swap generally costs 30 seconds or so, a double long lap penalty is at best half that, likely less. So people who took the penalty came out ahead, where as people who made the right call didn't get the full reward they deserved.

Edited 10 hours ago by GuzziMoto

[LowRyter]

I was three weeks old, the last time a French rider won the GP.  I think they broadcasted the race by telegraph. 

[p6x]

7 minutes ago, GuzziMoto said:

While it might be considered historic, I am not sure that would be because it was a great race. It was entertaining, but I have seen a lot of better races.

It was still a great race in my opinion, not because it was full of spectacular passes, for other reasons. There were still a lot of events that prevented the race to become a Marc Marquez at the front from lap 1 to lap 27. Let's not forget that Fabio Quartararo made pole. Which also was a surprise.

 

11 minutes ago, GuzziMoto said:

t was also a big warning shot to Ducati. While the race wasn't a complete disaster for them it was a clear warning that they are going down a dead end path. They appear to be making the same mistake Honda made and they had made back in the Stoner days. Making a bike that only one person can tame and go fast on. The 2025 Ducati is clearly slower then the 2024 Ducati for anyone not named Marc Marquez. All those years gaining front end feel has been lost faster then I thought they could. I figured this was going to happen, but I did not think they would go this far in one year with Marc.

Marc Marquez did it with Honda. He seemed to be the only one able to make the RCV perform, then the GP23 last year, and the GP25 this year. Would it be possible that Marquez is better at adapting his racing to match the perks of the bike? Bagnaia has said that he was going to forget about some of the old ways, to find a new path. But with both GP24 continuously challenging at the front with Alex and Fermin Aldeguer. Fabio DiGiannantonio has the other GP25 and then Franco Morbidelli had some showing on the GP24.

Ducati is confusing the issue by releasing conflicting statements regarding Francesco Bagnaia's difficulties. We will see what happens in Silverstone.

20 minutes ago, GuzziMoto said:

And the new rules about leaving the grid and / or swapping bikes / tires came into play. And while things did work smoothly I think it was clear that a double long lap penalty for the various options was not right. If you followed the rules and swapped bikes / tires after the race started you would have to pull down pitlane during the race. Where as people who took the penalty for leaving the grid or pulled into pitlane before the race started only had to do a double long lap penalty. Pulling down pitlane to swap generally costs 30 seconds or so, a double long lap penalty is at best half that, likely less. So people who took the penalty came out ahead, where as people who made the right call didn't get the full reward they deserved.

I think I would have described the situation as chaos! I think they need to come up with something better.

[p6x]

The rumor is that Jorge Martin is said to want out of Aprilia at the end of this year.

He has a clause in his contract, according to Motorsport.com, that if he is not able to compete for the championship top positions, he can leave the team.

There is a lot written about it on crash.net.

[p6x]

17 minutes ago, LowRyter said:

I was three weeks old, the last time a French rider won the GP.  I think they broadcasted the race by telegraph. 

Back in these days, the motorcycle races did not interest much people.

[GuzziMoto]

1 hour ago, p6x said:

The rumor is that Jorge Martin is said to want out of Aprilia at the end of this year.

He has a clause in his contract, according to Motorsport.com, that if he is not able to compete for the championship top positions, he can leave the team.

There is a lot written about it on crash.net.

Yes. But there seems to be only one place for him to go, Honda. And would Honda pick Martin over Acosta? I think Jorge Martin has screwed himself if this is true. He will have demoralized his team, poisoned the well in the team so to say. That will impact the rest of this season for him. And where does he think he is going from Aprilia? His only option seems to be Luca Marini's seat. And people already think Pedro Acosta is going to leave KTM and take that seat. If that happens, possibly Martin could take Acosta's KTM seat but right now that does not seem like a move up from where he is at. In fact, I don't see an available seat for him anywhere that would be a move upwards, I don't see any available seat for Martin that would give him a faster bike then what he has now. He seems to have a knack for shooting himself in the foot.

[LowRyter]

8 hours ago, p6x said:

Back in these days, the motorcycle races did not interest much people.

for sure, I didn't really care about it