dlaing

OK Here is a comparison

I think Scura-Rigging would be politically incorrect due to the history of hardship that they have endured slaving to merciless riders, with exploding clutches and poorly set up Ohlins But, Tenni-Riggin' is more acceptible, as they deserve the bashing and after all, a Tenni is nothing more than a good Bodge Job....BJ for short

Thanks for the motivating words. I just need to spend more time riding and actually tuning rather than searching for holy grails. I am actually pretty happy doing the tried and true method: "Generations of drivers have optimised their bikes with only the feedback their back and probably the plugs have given them and probably all of them had fun with this procedure." Perhaps I would be depriving myself of the joy of doing it "old school", if I shelled out money towards the "better" solutions. With a few tweaks of TuneBoy, the bike now runs better than ever. Refining it will be tricky, but I have patience and determination....experience will come with time and effort. Verification will be harder to come by, and the nay sayers will be dubious at best. One thing that I have determined with opinionated certainty, is that variations in weather greatly change the needs of the mixture and timing. I believe the altitude and temperature trims need more work than the base map. But the base fuel map and timing map are first on my hit list.

I should have said"what the tuning link considers optimal" The difference between what tuning link or a WBO2 considers optimal and what is optimal appears to vary, which is half of what this whole ECU thread is about. I am not sure how valuable Tuning Link and WBO2 are..and not everyone, including the professionals on this list, agree. That is why I am still on the fence and won't sell my PCIII.(at the moment it is off the bike, and the only reason I keep it is for Tuning Link, and maybe using the buttons for road tuning. Who are the professionals? Derek Capito from MotoLab tuning center, has made a very convincing argument that the WBO2 and Tuning Link sensors do not obtain enough data to analyze the emission thoroughly enough to create an accurate map. Todd Eagan, the motivator behind PCIIIs existing for Guzzis other than ours, has suggested, and many have verified through testimonials, that the Tuning Link works great. Cliff Jeffries, Father of the MY15M and Optimiser, has suggested that he gets excellent results using a WBO2 in closed loop to modify the map output under real world conditions. Wayne McDonald, Father of TuneBoy, has perhaps wisely stayed out of the WBO2 argument, but his product is supposed to support interpreting PCIII maps. So here I sit in the middle arguing with everyone, wondering if I should buy a WBO2 datalogger, a colortune, do a tuning link run everytime I modify my bike, trust a local dyno-tuner, or ride 500 miles for an appointment with MotoLab, whom I trust and agree would give the best result, but at a price I am not sure is worth it. I am kind of inclined to get the datalogger....about $600 after bungs, etc.

I like your avatar of the dog stiiffing the tailpipe....he knows which end to sniff, smart dog! Hey, don't you know Copa Cabana colors don't fly in the Scura Gang Hut. Perhaps if you replaced that pearly Coppa white silver with Black Or maybe Red Green Black and Gold

Some things to check: Make sure it has gas, it could have drained out durring the accident and you are running on fumes. Replace and gap sparkplugs Coil mounts could have gotten jarred, make sure it is properly seated and wire connections are good. What Cliff said.

errrh, uhm, I was being like serious, you know. I have a suspicion that YOU are the crack up. Monrovia, sounds like a commie town....

How about carabinieri e più dumber

I liked the bike and could stomach the TomTom cause it is geek sheik,but then it said, "new touring fairing with electrically adjustable screen"

We should do it soon...before Christmas! This weekend and December 10th/11th I am booked. Post a ride under the V11Lemans events forum and the SoCal forum. Do you have a link or address to the B&B?

Hey Carl, should I use a 50,000BTU propane torch or my OEM Guzzi batteries arc welding capabilites to solder your My15M ECU?

Thanks Cliff, I may take you up on that. I am reluctant to cut and solder anything I don't own. And I have been slow about asking Carl if he has the cables etc. I suppose I should private message Carl....or maybe he'll read this and start searching his boxes for cables and such

Why does the My15M require more technical expertise than TuneBoy? Obviously, My16 is available in kit form for people more talented than I, and the MY15M that Carl Allison loaned me requires more expertise, because it is an earlier version,and I don't know how to fabricate or obtain a PC Comms adapter, a little serial interface board, and a cable with a 25pin connector and a 5 pin header. I can probably cut the 2 PCB tracks and then solder on 2 wires. But I am too cheap to spend money getting this thing working, only to have to return it to Carl. But I thought your current line of ECU's is pretty straight forward and includes the necessary accessories listed above???????

Hey Wayne! What do you think of DynoJet's software? Honestly, I have had no problem with their software. And from what I can tell, Wayne's software is rock solid, but needs documentation and some re-labling of some of the features. If you look at the properties of his software, it says it is a beta version, and he did sell it to me at a reduced price, so my expectations at this point are not great. Right now, I am just tweaking the base map and the timing map, but I want to do more! And I want some feedback from Wayne. (?)I did just that, about 10 numbers, and it did get rid of the pinging in all but few circumstances. But I suspect retarding the timing is the better solution considering that the TuningLink indicated that my Air/Fuel ratio was optimal. I still think PCIIIs have some benefits like ease of use and cheap custom dyno maps, even if some of the maps have flaws. I am not selling my PCIII, because it gives me access to the Tuning Link Dyno Mapping. But the ability to map timing and more than just the fuel map, is why I went with TuneBoy....and for the diagnostic software that is not ready....yet.

I posted my reply in the ECU thread http://www.v11lemans.com/forums/index.php?...pic=4152&st=420 ...where everyone can agree to disagree.

The following is a response to a post elsewhere, that I would prefer to answer here: The software is not what I would call glitchy. Everything that I know works, works solidly. I wanted to give Wayne a chance to answer questions before I got deeply into the negatives. But on the surface, I covered all the negatives. More deeply, the documentation is lacking, and the tech support should be better, as I sent 3 messages over a month ago and got no response. I held back from criticizing the TuneBoy the same way I have held back from criticizing the PCIII and tuning link. Since you forced me to be fully candid about Tuneboy, it is only fair that I am now candid about PCIII and TuneEdit. I apparently am the owner of the one in million pcIIIs that actually failed. The fact that DynoJet claims such odds of reliability when I one bad unit in a million flawless units, does not lend itself to my believing them to be credible, and it does not give me faith that I can rely on the PCIII as I can rely on the ECU. My other peeve is with the Tuning Link and the inabilities of the lambda sensor to accurately determine the correct A:F ratio. I got my bike dyno tuned by Dyno Dudes and the bike ended up pinging worse after they tuned it. They said that is impossible because they enriched it, but clearly from the map, they made it run leaner where it was pinging. Pinging shown in red. 0 2 5 10 20 40 60 80 100 500 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1500 0 26 23 14 27 11 17 20 20 2000 0 0 17 0 5 -3 -2 -12 2 2500 0 0 15 17 -2 2 9 3 17 3000 0 0 0 20 1 17 15 21 29 3500 0 0 0 11 5 3 15 11 15 4000 0 0 0 17 7 1 14 22 24 4500 0 0 0 18 13 4 9 15 4 5000 0 0 0 18 20 4 -3 -6 -1 5500 0 0 0 0 24 1 -6 -7 -4 6000 0 0 0 0 0 1 -8 -6 -7 7000 0 0 0 0 0 -2 -2 -13 -10 8000 0 0 0 0 0 0 -3 -14 -17 I got no answer back from them as they obviously did not want to address the problem. In my opinion, the problem is has more to do with timing than richness and to the credit of the tuning link the A/F ratio may have been correct and the timing at fault, but leaning it out is not what needed to happen. This is something that a TuningLink will not deal with as well as "taking stabs" at re-mapping by trial and error and analysis of PCIII maps and Wide Band Commander data logs. I was also hoping that I could TuningLink my bike, and transcribe the map to the ECU, but I need Wayne's tech support to determine if it works... I have not lost complete faith in the DynoJet TuningLink process, especially if done one cylinder at a time. I can only imagine what a WBO2 sensor does when one cylinder runs rich and one lean and the sensor is reading the mix of both. Great News about the availability of the timing module. Too bad it was not available two months ago, or you might have had me lining up for that and a USB PCIII. I may still go with DynoJet for a Wide Band commander as they do write first class software, unless Todd can talk me out it. Sorry, for the "ecu ad nauseum".

Welcome Wallace! Nice Bike!

Don't worry about feeling naked. If you rode a V11Sport instead of a V11LeMans, you would really be naked I'll be praying for a Chinookful Winter for you! ...or some warm clothes

Excellent idea! With luck we can keep the focus on the excellent product. There is no diagnostic software, yet. Here are the current features: It has 3D graphing capabilities, so you can graph the maps. The available tables are: the base fuel map, the offset map(whatever that is), the ignition map(Yah baby!), a start enrich map(whatever that is), an accell enrich map(whatever that is), idle ignition(whatever that is), air temperature trim, engine temperature trim, and barometric trim. The documentation could be improved as I only have the Aprillia documentation. I still have to figure out the above features suffixed with (whatever that is), and how to Apply the PCIII map. Also, the sofware shows: RPM, TP, injector pulse width, ignition adv, and O2 voltage. If you want to read my error filled posts in the ECU thread, with some screenshots of some maps, go here, to page 26 of the ECU thread.

Tonti Lives!

Daddy, can I have a Norge and a Vintage for Christmas? I think Santa Guzzi was reading some of our wish lists. The retrofication of the Cali and a true Sport-TOURER were overdue

That data logger is an excellent tool! What did you need to do to hook it up? Weld in Bungs? hook up to coils? hook up to tps? or does it hook up to the ECU like a PCIII? With enough runs, you should really be able to refine that map. Thanks for posting the graphs. It will give me a better clue about where to try enriching on my bike...or it may just be the encouragement I need to go get one. There is some debate over how much one can fully depend on a WBO2 to determine proper llambda. I suspect that if it reads too lean, you enrichen it, and then it reads nicely, then it is doing its job well. Perhaps not as well as a dyno run where power is optimized, but considering all the numbers above 14:1 and below 13:1 that you can improve on, the WBO2 with data logging is worth its weight in gold.

They need a Scura unltd edition

That would be truly awesome if the fork sliders were made from titanium....but titanium nitride coating is pretty slick anyway.

Odds are, 15 times out of 19.5 times, it would notice. Theoretically if you are off by only one mV, it could shift the ECU's reading just as much as being off by 19.5mV.....but not likely. It is interesting that you noticed the bike run worse from a mere 15mv shift. I know that if I paid for a $1000 dyno map, I would be sure to set the TPS as accurately to 150mV as my skills could easily allow. When I had a PCIII dynomap done, I was lazy and did not bother with the TPS. Luckily my TPS is only off by 15mV, but I should have documented the high and low TPS readings. In anycase, I traded the muffler that was dyno'd, so it is all water under the bridge. Next time, I know to be more careful. FWIW, I think there is still uncertainty even with regards to measuring with engine on or off. I favor engine off, lighting fuse and headlight pulled, but YMMV. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzzy_logic