Lucky Phil

5.7 Litre Chev, 6 speed owned since new still love it.

It doesn't necessarily mean the odysseys, caused the failures I know, but the fact that Ducati Energia won't guarantee the VR if it is used with an Odyssey does concern me. On the basis of what I've gleaned so far I'm going to replace my battery with something else (probably Yuasa, as this is what Guzzi now specify for the V11) asap - VRs cost more than batteries. Here in Australia the battery costs more than the regulator! Ciao

My bike a little while back was eating Odyssey batteries which I initially put down to a faulty std reg overcharging. After research here and advice from Roy I traced it to the headlight wiring voltage drop issue and wired the headlights direct to the battery via relays and the Reg output voltage went back to the 14.2 volt range. I had already purchased an Electrosport reg ( plug and play version) which I never bothered using as I had solved the issue so cant comment on its performance. Doesn't hurt to carry a spare as it will fit the ST2 as well I think from memory. Ciao

Yes Roy headlight pin 30 has power with the ignition off. Ciao

This I believe is just a small manufacturer covering their arses. AGM and LI batteries are very sensitive to overcharging and they don't want the hassle of warranty claims for bikes with dodgy wiring designs like the Guzzi has or finicky LI batteries that require very tight charging current control. You are far better to under charge an LI battery than leave it on the charger after it has reached %100 charge. Old wet cell lead acid batteries are a lot more tolerant to overcharging. Ciao

Roy is this a poor choice in wording or the actual case? My wiring the headlights direct to the battery via relays solved the overcharging issue and I have no undercharging problems. Ciao

If you want to improve the shifting of your V11 out of sight and lessen the issue of the lever hitting the pork chop on down shifts then extend the shift lever arm and drill another hole for the rod end 12mm center to center from the upper hole. This gives the gear box return spring more leverage over the shift lever and also means the lever has to move less at the toe peg for a given input on the shift rod. So you can adjust the shift lever down a little more and it will still select the gears, if that's what you need. It also Means that the shift action is slightly heavier and this makes for a more positive shift action. So a reduced shifter pedal throw ( now in line with a Japanese gearbox) more positive shift action and better shift lever return after you shift. I supplied a link here a while ago for the full process as well as the internal selector mechanism tuning I did on the wildguzzi site complete with photos. The lever extension is a huge improvement and I have covered enough miles on my bike now to confidently recommend doing it. Ciao

From memory it was somewhere in the middle, and didn't feel particularly different to the original Scura single-plater (which only had about 3,000 miles on it, and which I only replaced due to paranoia about exploding flywheels). From which I assumed that the swap had been completely straightforward. Ok thanks, was just thinking that if the actuating rod was a bit long for the ram unit then you would expect the release point would be closer to the lever fully out(relaxed) position and the slave cylinder piston would be pushed back further towards it end point and therefore not be able to compensate for wear as well. Looks like you may just have a worn friction plate. Ciao

moscowphil, out of interest when you went to the Ram clutch on your bike (new friction plate etc) at what point did the clutch dis-engage/engage when you pulled the lever? So when you pulled the clutch lever at what point in the lever travel did the clutch release or conversely at what point did it begin to bite? Did it release very early in the lever pull or did you need to get it nearly all the way back to the bar before it would disengage and then the engagement would also be close to the bar of course? Or was this point right near the fully relaxed end of the lever travel? Ciao

Well you are right in thinking that I can't have measured the thickness of the plate very accurately - short of removing the clutch the only way to do it was using a caliper through the inspection hole. It looked pretty much un-worn but I wouldn't like to put a figure on it. However, I'm unconvinced that a friction plate can be worn out after less than 1mm wear. In theory the thickness of the friction material should be of no consequence providing there is some friction material left. The friction material does not provide structural strength to the plate, this is the job of the inner steel core, so loss of friction material as the plate wears should not cause any problems apart from the lack of adjustment one I've experienced. After all, a similar single plate diaphragm design is used in virtually all car clutches, which regularly last 100,000 miles, despite being given a much harder time than my clutch ever gets. I wonder whether the reports of clutch plates being "worn out" at low mileages are actually other people suffering the same lack of adjustment problem as me? What you fail to understand is that clutch slippage from a worn friction plate is due to the fact that the pressure plate travel reaches its limit at the engaged end of the travel and therefore cant apply the same degree of spring pressure.This is usually signified by slipping and running out of actuating free play which is what you have. Clutch fiction plate thickness reduction of 1mm would be a worn out clutch. Ciao Why would shimming the slave make any difference then? Well if it is indeed a worn out friction plate and it may not be, I just think its a likely possibility having high wear rate for these units mentioned by a well known and respected Guzzi mechanic/dealer in Australia. I also am aware that there are later Ram specific friction plates available that are advertised as being of greater durability ( see MG cycles, version 4 I think and they are up to and it is 6.68mm thickness as opposed to 5.5 for the old version). The later plate also requires a shorter actuating rod. So put it all together and you have a possibility. The question here is when the Ram plate is worn out is it the pressure plate/diaphram that reaches its limit of effectivity or is it the actuating system, ie the piston travel on the slave? That I don't know. If the limiting factor is the slave travel then either shimming it out or at some point in the life of the clutch you go to a shorter rod and get extra wear out of the friction plate. Maybe the Ram unit doesn't have a high rate of wear its just a case of the actuating system isn't well matched to the diaphram design, don't know. As is often the case though in these forum posts its impossible to tell what parts were used in the clutch conversion so that also a factor. I have a new single plate Ram unit in the workshop to go into the V11 when I fit the Daytona engine and was debating with the previously mentioned knowledge on the wear rates of the earlier versions which mine is whether or not to even use the original new plate or just buy the latest version with the greater durability. Upon reflection I wouldn't be surprised if the original 5.5mm plate though is too thin for the operating system and that is the limiting factor. I was surprised when I saw the new version 4 plate was over 1mm thicker than the original, i was expecting just a material change. Also 1mm of wear or there abouts will be a worn out clutch in most cases. The friction material on all single plate clutches I have ever see car or bike is generally only around .5mm above the securing rivets so that amount of wear on both sides and the clutch is gone. Ciao

Well you are right in thinking that I can't have measured the thickness of the plate very accurately - short of removing the clutch the only way to do it was using a caliper through the inspection hole. It looked pretty much un-worn but I wouldn't like to put a figure on it. However, I'm unconvinced that a friction plate can be worn out after less than 1mm wear. In theory the thickness of the friction material should be of no consequence providing there is some friction material left. The friction material does not provide structural strength to the plate, this is the job of the inner steel core, so loss of friction material as the plate wears should not cause any problems apart from the lack of adjustment one I've experienced. After all, a similar single plate diaphragm design is used in virtually all car clutches, which regularly last 100,000 miles, despite being given a much harder time than my clutch ever gets. I wonder whether the reports of clutch plates being "worn out" at low mileages are actually other people suffering the same lack of adjustment problem as me? What you fail to understand is that clutch slippage from a worn friction plate is due to the fact that the pressure plate travel reaches its limit at the engaged end of the travel and therefore cant apply the same degree of spring pressure.This is usually signified by slipping and running out of actuating free play which is what you have. Clutch fiction plate thickness reduction of 1mm would be a worn out clutch. Ciao

How did you measure the thickness of the friction plate. The difference in thickness between a new plate and a worn out plate is quite small, maybe less than 1mm. These clutches are known for their high wear rate on the earlier friction plate versions. Ciao

That is the outcome I would expect with the different rods. What you felt with the stock rod is the rubber bushes flexing and resisting the movement of the arm. Noticeable in this test but in real world riding I couldn't feel the difference in suspension action between the std and Rossopuro. Such is the case with many mechanical things, what the theory and bench testing exhibits isn't necessarily a significant factor in the riding. A little like the Guzzi engine torque reaction. At standstill its noticeable but riding its not noticeable or an issue. Ciao

There should be no FREE axial or lateral movement in the reaction rod. The pinion bearing will have a little radial movement, Ciao

The rubber coupling will be torn from fatigue or maybe perished if its been subjected to a hi ozone environment and therefore have play. Ciao

Some info on maintenance free rod ends. http://www.skf.com/au/products/bearings-units-housings/spherical-plain-bearings-bushings-rod-ends/maintenance-free-rod-ends/index.html Ciao

You can get rod ends with composite bearing material that don't require lube. As the std Rossopuro ones fitted to my bike and the std gearshift linkage rod ends fitted to the V11. Ciao

As I mentioned I couldn't feel any difference in suspension performance but then again I didn't do a " back to back" blind test and my bike has an all singing and dancing Wilbers rear shock. The theory says the rod and bearings should have less impact on suspension movement and that may be the case. As for the practicality well rod end bearings are fairly inexpensive as is a piece of aluminium rod of the required length. Having a lather at home i think I could machine up a rod in about 15 minutes, 25 if I wanted it to look fancy and wasted down. So if you have a local machine shop around, count on an hours labor, say what, $60, a piece of stock at $10 and a pair of rod ends at maybe $35 for 2. So around $100 all up...cheap. Then you have something that is lighter, looks better is easier to service and if you choose the right rod ends, nil lubricating. Is there really a decision here when the original one comes to the end of its life? Ciao

Why would you mess about with all of this when you can run a simple cheap and light rod with rose joints at each end? Ciao

I've had both types ( std and Rossopuro) fitted to my V11 and I can feel zero difference in the way the suspension works and the level of vibration or shock transmitted. Ciao

Yes the same. As I pointed out in another thread it seems, no cushioning is necessary. The original design is what it is because its cheap to make, less machining. One machining operation and press fit some bushes. Cheap and cheerful. It has to be a hydrolastic bush only because its bolted up tight. The bush is there to allow the rear suspension to work not for shock absorption. A rod ended torque arm has zero end or side float and the anchor points at both the frame and Bevel box are cruise liner dimensions. So they are rugged. In case nobody has noticed Guzzi don't just over engineer everything they over engineer it then add some. That's why they weigh a ton. Ciao

Wow, did I really resurrect this thread! Don't know how that happened. Ciao

Looks like you need the 5001230 at HMB Guzzi (series1 gasket) but check the photo of the series 2 as well. One of the holes is bigger on the series 2. http://hmb-guzzi.de/Timing-cover-gasket-metal-newer-Big-Twins-1st-series Ciao

there would be NO give whatsoever in the rod. So what, give is not required with spherical bearings. The only reason the rod and spherical bearing solution is not used in the first place is a cost of manufacture and maintenance one. The Rossopuro unit works well, looks good and bearings are cheap and easy to replace when need arises. Ciao

Of course you can. Thats what my bike has effectively in the form of a Rossopuro unit. Ciao