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Me too....took a long time though...too long

Here's what the 2 versions of the std damper look like. There's a little more science to NVH and handlebar vibration dynamics than homespun rubber hose jammed into handlebars and other solutions. Sure you can ignore the R&D that's gone into the factory's efforts and you might just come up with "something" but at the end of the day it's going to vibrate at some point and how much time are you going to put into it. 27 is the rubber "pad" and 28 the weight. 2002 on. Early version. 99-2002. 19 weight. Ciao

Can't comment on a V11 but .... a comment about Guzzi's in general fielded from the store owner I bought my bike from went "It's a good day when something goes wrong on a Guzzi as it gives you a chance to make it even better." And I will qualify this by the thoughts, how many times can the big end be machined, the bore oversized, the frame straightened without favour or just things worked on without fear of running out of material or strength when doing so. So many modern machines are made right on their performance edge and are deemed disposable after 100,000km or have some form of break down. Guzzi's seem to dare their owners to, go on, get the spanners out, you know you want to! They seem to be a big boys Mechano set that can upgraded in so many ways. Chris.

Very well said my good man................

Yes. As for the bolts, that is what loctite is for. I'm more a fan of midrange RPM, but I will find the right cadence for the Guzzi in the Spring and go from there.

You can also use a Crampbuster, I find this indispensable on all of my bikes to eliminate any wrist cramping, but it also tends to isolate some of the vibes to the palm of the hand, not the fingers or wrist. On the other hand a well tuned V11 should be pleasant to ride at that rpm level, so I'd get quite a few more rides in to see if it's really behaving oddly or just a question of bonding with the bike. However, above 6k and on up, the bike does smooth out a lot...just depends if you like to ride at higher RPM's or not...I'll call this hooligan territory for lack of a better word as the responsiveness is instantaneous, but I'm sure you're used to that also with the Ducatis. Either way, it's fun figuring it out and tinkering, as long as there are no bolts loose anywhere, and these bikes do require inspection of every bolt on a regular basis as I've been told by Chuck, Mike at MPH and others...and it's true!

Yes, use the stock bar end wieghts as stoppers jamming in a length of rubber hose that is just longer than the available internal length and has its OD just smaller than the ID of the bar. This is assuming of course that your clip ons are hollow! This should negate some of the waves travelling up and down each end. Chris.

Ok but as docc points out and I alluded to the Guzzi 15M ecu has no relearn or learn functionality. Later ECU's do for Idle and some car ecu's such as the one fitted to my old Monaro (Pontiac GTO) have quite sophisticated ecu learning capabilities so they can for example detect if the air filter is very dirty and make fuelling adjustments to compensate. They also have "short term" and "long term" learning capability. Sometimes I pick up on phrases and cues to determine an experts actual knowledge to determine what a situation is. Ciao

The only parameter my V11 ever "relearned" has been the undauntable effects of gravity. Otherwise, it's 15m ECU doesn't have that capability. Pretty sure that started with the next (W5AM?) ECU in 2006.

G'day folk's Really hope to be able to get out and about soon to take a few photo's to share! It's a funny ole time here in Oz what with Melbourne being the world's most locked down city and only gaining freedom not long ago, and now the exodus is on in earnest to make up for lost time + CRAZY and WILD weather usually at the bloody weekends too, has made it hard to get out and about. Now that we seem to be able to have a normal Christmas with family and friends a lot of time will be spent catching up! I was planning to get away for a weekend in December before the holidays started but didn't eventuate due to Family /Work /House chores and WEATHER so reckon it'll be Feb before I can get out on the bike again as EVERYWHERE is booked out and packed due to said exodus to our regional areas as people reluctant to travel interstate for fear of border closures etc... I do get a reprieve in that I'm taking the bike into work at our Dandenong branch tomorrow morning and my Niece's for Xmas day so this could be the extent of it for a wee bit... Hope some of our other Southern Brethren may be able to chime in in the meantime...? Cheers Guzzler

I totally get it about Guzzis now that I have one. I really "get" it.

I don't know if quirky is appropriate, I would reserve that to describe the traits on some of the UJM's I've had, my Suzuki DL1000 VStrom had hours worth of tupperware to remove just to see what had to be removed to do a valve adjustment; all held together with magical rubiks cube plastic fasteners that only divulged the magic password after you broke a few. The top notch engineers at Suzuki after much design work and testing, determined that Oxygen was the best material for the seat for the hydraulic clutch seal, now that's Quirky, but I digress Guzzis at the core, are pretty straight forward, simple engineering, that reward hands on involved ownership. If every time a valve cover leaks, the sump drips a bit of oil, the side stand bolt loosens, the grounds get corroded, you want to make a run ro a dealer to fix the peripheral nigglies, I think you're setting yourself up for a world of heartache. For that matter, just trying to find a dealer can be an exercise in frustration , let alone find one that can do quality work. Guzzis reward what you put into them imo, I've never felt that planted on pavement on any other brand, the engine powerband has a character that works well in the real world. I will admit to having more of a fondness for the flowing gracefulness of the Tonti framed bikes, you can tell when you work on a Spine frame that they evolved on a race track, added brace, changed this or that, bolted together here there and everywhere, it's quite the collection of fastenings, brackets and bits. fwiw ymmv

The 'fits and niggles' of our era Guzzi are a result of an old world motor co being kept on life support by passionate Italian folk who simply refused to let it die. Guzzi was a normal competitive motorcycle co. and relative equal in the moto world till the CB750 emerged in '69. A day of reckoning for every other brand as well. It was up to the "driven" players and the bean counters to make necessary changes (if the money was there) or let your marque die. So think of it from the business decisions made at the time while many other brands went by the wayside, Guzzi moved ahead with what they had. An old motor they couldn't afford to replace, and the desire to build and sell bikes. They spent what they could on what they felt was a priority. Internationally, police motorcycles kept a cash flow. Dr John Wittner gave them the public performance injection needed at just the right time. Sure there were other models available but the spine frames were what kept the marque moving forward technically, at a pretty dark time. When I look at the stupid wiring or bicycle grade gauges, or sub standard castings, or obvious afterthought arrangements, I see acceptable loss when all that mattered was a price point that had to be reached. I see passion and patriotism, and love. I don't get the feeling they were cheating in any way to just make money. (C'mon, you know nylon is not what designers preferred for gas tanks) What we're left with is the answer to a math problem several decades old. The sooner you think of your bike as the Italians had to to just get her produced and to market, the sooner you can learn to have a glass of wine and just enjoy the relationship. Just change what they could not. To me 'strange and quirky'.. are, for my Guzzi, terms of endearment.... like... "my girlfriend is crazy" but you should meet her, and you'll see everything about her is not "standard."

Early reports of grip vibration (along with reports of "twitchy" handling) on the RedFrame Sports likely led rather quickly to the V11 Longframe and wider rear wheel/tire with longer forks to attach the clip-ons above the top triple clamp. Then: ~ handlebars ~ . . . Seriously, for a RedFrame Sport: beyond performing, repeatedly, a meticulous Decent Tune-up, setting up the suspension with springs correct for your weight and settling on reliable tires/tire pressures will work wonders for your Sport's "feel." Otherwise, I would say the early Sport naturally feels more like a Fender P-bass through a Marshall amp in a concrete corner than a cello in the forest . . .

Sorry, the clip on them selves are solid. My bad. I have a handlebar conversion and the take off parts in a box. I think the bars are filled with lead shot. Typically the bars shake at idle and smooth out. 3k+ is the sweet spot.

Also back in the 80' Honda made internal vibration dampners for hollow handle bars. These were not end bar wieghts but a simple pair of heavy steel rods with expanding rubber rings at both ends. Insert rods into each end of the bars and tighten the screw (in much the same manner as end bar weights). My memory of these is that they worked well in the 4500rpm vibration zone inline fours were plagued with. Anything internal like this will change the natural harmonic frequency of the bars and take it away from your trouble spot without changing the 'look' of the bike. Come to think of it, a simple rubber sleeved expanding bolt may serve just as well as a proprietary dampener! Chris.

He's been working on Ducati and Guzzi since the 1980s. He's working at a Guzzi dealer, and always does top work for me. I think my bike is fine in his very capable hands.

Well, I think, the Guzzi's are in general over-dimensioned (if that is the correct English word). And the use of proven automotive parts, like a a 2kW startermotor (on the old Tonti's) replace durability tests. The large crankshaft bearings and not extreme torque, over-dimensioned parts in the gearbox, make the lower part of the engine block very durable by design. And the top engine part is all very easy to maintain. But the comparison with family affaire is not so bad :-)

The Japanese will change specifications mid-year. They are very traditional, but have few mechanical traditions. Thus, if a better part is proposed, it goes in mid-year. In Mandello del Lario, I think that parts are more like a family affair, so the bits and pieces do not change all that much. Except...

I used to work in automotive(4 wheels) aftermarket parts, even before I was riding a Guzzi. It struck me that all parts that we distributed for all brands of vehicles in Europe, were not very usable for the Honda and Suzuki motorcycles that I was riding. Later, when I started riding the LeMans 2 (in 1999, so it was already an "oldy"), I saw all kinds of parts that were considered universal in the stock of this aftermarket distributor on the LeMans. Sparkplugs, contact-breakers(standard for alfa, fiat, marelli), ignition coils, starter motor, revision parts for the generator, headlights. Wiring colors were the same as Fiat, connectors the same, battery was standard(good price)etc etc. The whole machine can be maintained in an agriculture workshop, tolerances are not very critical, tools are mainly standard or easy to make. This machine is a dream for everybody that has basic engineering interest. You get a lot of confirmation that you improve, because things are understandably explained in available manuals, parts are relatively in-expensive and available, and repairs turn out to be successful (or it is easy to do it again). On top of that, parts for newer models are often compatible with older models (and improved). I know it sounds ridiculous, but in the end you come to love each nut and bolt in the machine. Just look at this forum where people talk on the wire thickness of the retainer spring for the shift mechanism, and the little bolt on the jiffy, and the 20mm or 19mm red-frame/black frame discussions and many , many more. That is unique, I enjoy this very much and I am in constant adoration of those that have discovered again new perspectives on parts, types and even nuts and bolts. I love to be part of that.

What competition?

What makes Moto Guzzi quirky? How about distinctive, unique, different, etc? I think it's because they generally do their own thing and are not trying to copy anybody. Historically, at least, they seem to be designed and built by real-world riders and enthusiasts. And I think location matters a bit too. With the factory nestled in the Italian Alps, they make bikes suited to endless twisty roads, and aren't overly concerned with peak horsepower or 0-60mph times. They build bikes for the real world.

I ordered a Ford Bronco over a year ago, threw down my $100 deposit when they started taking reservations. Still don't have it due to various shortages. I assume it will be my last new ICE 4-wheeler. At this point, the only likely candidate for a new ICE motorcycle is a Husqvarna FE350S. But I kind of like the new Honda Trail 125. But gosh - that's pretty close to the price of an electric bicycle. And I assume large countries, like the US, Canada, and Australia will be slower to ban ICE vehicles, just due to the distances people want to drive. It's gonna take a lot of infrastructure to support long drives. All that said, I am toying with the idea of a plug-in hybrid vehicle for all the boring driving. But so far, that seems about as exciting as buying a refrigerator.

Part of me wonders if we'll even be around by that date....

To your point, "[What makes Guzzis quirky]?" It really is, JMO, that they require an immersed owner. No shop or tech can deliver it back to us fully capable. This would be like the veterinarian delivering our dog back to us spayed and dew claws removed. It remains to us to train and bond with this *animal* . . . What? The Guzzi is like a living, breathing, thinking animal? Compared to common machinery? Yes. We would not be the first to suppose such thinking . . . "A skittish motor-bike with a touch of blood in it is better than all the riding animals on earth, because of its logical extension of our faculties, and the hint, the provocation, to excess conferred by its honeyed untiring smoothness. Because Boa loves me, he gives me five more miles of speed than a stranger would get from him." – T. E. Lawrence

Ah, all good then. Those can be reconstituted with a little vino, olive oil, heat and parmigiana. Like good food, the V11 responds to involvement. But does not suffer neglect.

You're not trying to say that the V11 electrical system is like a wearing a G-string in a Calgary crosswind?

An excellent description, as always, Docc! 😆 I'll learn to deal with it, one way or the other. Love my Guzzi.

What makes you think they are "so quirky?" (I mean, besides the community. ---> ) You know, besides the Rube Goldberg sidestand . . . And, of course, the gauges might need some creative embellishments . . .

In spite of themselves, they are a quite reliable machine. My favorite reads were of those by the guy from Seattle that used to make the "Alaska" run and he'd post about all the parts he came back with in his saddlebags... that just kinda fell off, but weren't really needed. I guess it's a matter of with a little love, they will get you home. My story is a Convert I purchased, rode home from PA to MD, then to VA to have it looked at because it wasn't running right. Imagine my surprise when they showed me I was only on one cylinder !!!!!! I mean the bike was sluggish, and barely made it up to highway speeds... but it got me home and out to a mechanic.. That was when I really started taking a serious look at Moto Guzzi and I finally "got it."

Errrm, uhmmm, the community?

NEVER! EVER! EVER! TOUCH OR ADJUST THE THROTTLE STOP SCREW ON A W5AM CONTROLLED BIKE! The idle speed is hard coded into the ECU and is governed by a stepper motor. The system doesn't use a MAF sensor and if you move that screw you completely @#!#$# the fueling as the throttle angle is set on a flow bench at the factory and if you mess with it it is virtually impossible to get it right again! Also if your mate's bike is a 2009 it will be a flat tappet model and unless he has had it rollerised there is no point in doing anything to it until it has been. How many Km on it now and does it have a service history? Pete PS? If you messed with the throttle stop screw on the Sport that might well explain the high idle. I'll give a full run down on tuning a W5AM bike a bit later, they are ridiculously simple but still after ten or more years in production there are still people, including many shops, getting it wrong!

Yes.